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Slinging with bad shoulder (Read 1318 times)
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Re: Slinging with bad shoulder
Reply #15 - Jul 16th, 2022 at 4:37am
 
The multiple Balearic Champion Diego Camuñas uses a fairly low effort underhand technique in his mid 70s with high effect, you could try that

Kick I remember you made a video, did you upload it to youtube yet?

I tried it and it works fairly well, this is my backup technique when overhand and figure8 are not more possible 😉
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Thearos
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Re: Slinging with bad shoulder
Reply #16 - Jul 16th, 2022 at 4:46am
 
I thought Diego Camunas was more of a sidearm ?
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Re: Slinging with bad shoulder
Reply #17 - Jul 16th, 2022 at 9:55am
 
Thearos, Thank you for the video.

You can try this method. This is my idea of the underarm style. I can throw with it to 100 meters.

It's the wrist that turns, not the arm. At the drop, release the retaining line at the beginning of the ascent with your arm horizontal.
Like the tapestry of Bayeux if you want an historical example.
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Re: Slinging with bad shoulder
Reply #18 - Jul 16th, 2022 at 2:53pm
 
That's exactly the drawing I was thinking of ! That final picture always seemed to me the epitome of mechanical ineffectiveness, with that uplifted, forced shoulder. Can you really make it work so well for yourself ?
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Re: Slinging with bad shoulder
Reply #19 - Jul 16th, 2022 at 2:54pm
 
Of course, Thierry La Fronde also slings underarm, but his style is terrible
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Re: Slinging with bad shoulder
Reply #20 - Jul 17th, 2022 at 1:25am
 
I see that I was already griping about underhand style in 2010:

https://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1274311439/0

that Finney's thesis is available here (ht Wanderer)
http://eprints.bournemouth.ac.uk/396/1/Jon_Bryant_Finney.pdf

and that he got underwhelming results with his underhand (as noted by Morningstar)

and that Aussie got into the physics, as usual.
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Re: Slinging with bad shoulder
Reply #21 - Jul 18th, 2022 at 10:43am
 
Thearos wrote on Jul 16th, 2022 at 4:20am:
It always seemed to me mechanically inefficient. This was striklngly illustrated by an archaeological article on slinging and hillforts, where a series of drawings broke down the movement (the drawings showed a bearded man, presumably the author, in a sort of tunic). The end movement and release, with a sort of raised shoulder and hopeful upwards movement of the whole body on tiptoes, were familiar to me from experimentation, and particularly reminded me of how weak the form is at converting body movement into forward release and speed. I seem to remember the underarm form used by other specialists (Thom Richardson), with bad results. The idea that this would have been used historically struck me as unlikely. In contrast, helicopter, sidearm, and fig-8 all converge into effective release in the final stage. They are all attested historically and ethnographically. Is there any evidence at all for underarm being used in such contexts ?

I also find timing of release more problematic with underarm often resulting in ridiculous upwards shots, difficult to adjust. And I speak as someone whose shots aways drag left and high.

These two reasons (mechanical weakness; problematic release times) are why I don't sling underarm, preferring helo (before shoulder issues and in spite of slack issues), "Makron" (one rotation from body facing away), and now sidearm (vertical rotation(s) and side-release).


   Of course every slinger is different but I don't find Underarm to be mechanically weaker.  The reason why I don't get quite the distance from an Underarm shot is that the topspin associated with such a shot causes the projectile to drop rather than rise as does a shot with backspin on it.  I also don't have any problems with the release of an Underarm shot.  But slinging is a very individualized sport so to each their own.
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Re: Slinging with bad shoulder
Reply #22 - Jul 18th, 2022 at 12:51pm
 
I went slinging and tried the Finney-style undearm and shuddered with disgust
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Re: Slinging with bad shoulder
Reply #23 - Jul 18th, 2022 at 1:31pm
 
You just felt dirty? Didn't you? lol
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Re: Slinging with bad shoulder
Reply #24 - Jul 19th, 2022 at 1:24am
 
My english is not very good. It's sometimes difficult to explain my ideas.

Do not gesticulate the arm.
Just turn the wrist. I turn twice, accelerating constantly.
When releasing, throw your wrist forward.
And rotate your wrist so that the opening does not go up but to your left side, if you want to increase the distance.

The important thing is the constant acceleration during the two handle turns.

Thearos, your video is "les grandes batailles du passé", "the great battles of the past. This tv show is at least fourty years old. It's nice to see it again so long after.
Thanks.
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Re: Slinging with bad shoulder
Reply #25 - Jul 19th, 2022 at 3:21am
 
Yes, that works, but that is not how Dr Finney slings, with his horrible shoulder lift. I call this style "Thierry le Bossu". We all know that it's the sling, not the arm, that does the work ! What you describe is a sort of relaxed sidearm, I have no problem with that.

I watched "Les Grandes Batailles" by Henri de Turenne as a child, and later in video. I always loved the Alesia one.
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Re: Slinging with bad shoulder
Reply #26 - Jul 19th, 2022 at 5:14am
 
My english is not good.
My release isn't sidearm but it's really underarm.
Finney's style is his conception of underarm. Gesticulate the arm is not a good idea.
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Re: Slinging with bad shoulder
Reply #27 - Jul 19th, 2022 at 8:36am
 
Finney was not a slinger.
Pretty much everything he ever said about slinging was completely wrong.

So, yeah, if that's your only reference, you will have problems Smiley

Good, hard and accurate underarm is done without using your shoulder in any significant way.
It's actually the best style to learn first, as it demonstrates what the sling can do with very little effort on the users part.
It's mainly wrist, with a little elbow, and like every other style, just another weapon in a slingers armoury.

Like the underhand in this, but done standing up Smiley
https://youtu.be/1xSdOtttLAo

Also the sidearm in that is pretty shoulder friendly.
And used with legs and waist, really good for power and accuracy.
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