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Question: Target Size

Standard Balearic 'Diana' (50cm)    
  7 (70.0%)
Target (30cm)    
  1 (10.0%)
Other    
  2 (20.0%)




Total votes: 10
« Created by: Archaic Arms on: Nov 14th, 2021 at 6:28am »

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New Ranking System (Read 2347 times)
Curious Aardvark
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Re: New Ranking System
Reply #90 - Dec 9th, 2021 at 11:06am
 
Quote:
This is turning into a game with a weird scoring system more than a ranking system.

same thing, surely ?

Now one thing that can effect people's scores is the height the target is mounted.

Particularly at distance.

It's relatively easy to hit a ground level target at distance with a lob.
The same target at head height is a lot harder to hit and requires a much more powerful throw. 

So a fixed height would be a good idea.

Quote:
50 or so yards seems to be the point where the coin starts to become difficult to see,

Okay now that really made me laugh.
seriously, even with my glasses on I'd struggle to see a 10 pence at 10 yards, let alone stand any chance of hitting it with a sling missile Smiley

I don't mind a bit of bias in the system, but give us poor old and broken buggers a chance whistle
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joe_meadmaker
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Re: New Ranking System
Reply #91 - Dec 10th, 2021 at 8:38am
 
I've been thinking about this and have a thought.  It's really just a small adjustment of what's already been discussed.

The ranking system works off a set of 10 throws.  Five confirmed hits are required to move to the next level (league).  A slinger is also free to keep working at a particular level if they want to achieve 10/10 perfection.  The set of 10 can be cherry-picked from a larger set as discussed earlier.

A slinger's ranking will be a 2 digit number (could be 3, but I don't think anyone will get that high).  The first digit is the current distance.  A '1' for 10m, '2' for 20m, etc.  The second digit is the number of hits. at the distance.

A few examples to demonstrate:
A rank of 32 will mean the slinger has two target hits at 30 meters.
A rank of 25 will mean the slinger has five hits at 20 meters.  At this point they can move to 30 meters, or continue working at 20m for a better score at that level.
A rank of 28 will mean the slinger has opted to continue working at 20m, and has eight hits.  They can also move to 30 at any time.

If a slinger does get a perfect 10/10 at any level, they will automatically have a ranking for the next distance.  So if someone gets 10/10 at 10 meters, their ranking will be 20.

I think the advantages of this method are things are based off an easy to interpret 2-digit number.  It also allows two paths if someone wants to chase perfection vs. just advancing to the next level.  A slinger's rank will also increase with each additional hit, so there's immediate feedback to feel good about.  Smiley

On the topic of video evidence, I think we'll be safe in trusting what someone tells us within a particular level.  But video will be needed for level advancement.  So if I'm just starting out, I can tell everyone that my best was 4 hits at 10m.  And my rank is 14 without video (I can provide video for fun and entertainment, but it's not required).  If I get 5 hits at 10. and want to move on to 20m, I must provide video confirmation.

Let me know if anything in that explanation isn't clear.

Thoughts?
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Morphy
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Re: New Ranking System
Reply #92 - Dec 10th, 2021 at 4:15pm
 
I think something like this could work if its fleshed out a little more. With the current system as you laid it out Joe a slinger with a rank of 39 would be 100 times more skilled than a slinger with a rank of 42.
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joe_meadmaker
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Re: New Ranking System
Reply #93 - Dec 10th, 2021 at 6:57pm
 
You have a point.  But I think that becomes very difficult to account for.  If any (or even all) of those 9 hits are closer to the edge, it's likely they wouldn't have been hits at 40m.

On a side note, probably something for the Maths board, I wonder what the effective diana size at 30m would be to represent a target at 40m. It still wouldn't be a perfect representation, because with more distance the release angle will need to change.  But I'm curious.

Back on topic, I don't know if a simple system will be able to combine different path intentions (such as climbing a rank ladder vs. getting a perfect score at every level), and judge them fairly against each other (unless of course a perfect score is required at each level).  A more complex method of determine a rank very well could.  But I think that could make getting participation more difficult.  In the system I described, you're right that they don't really line up.  The intent was moreso to allow for both aspects since each one seems to have support in the discussion.
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Morphy
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Re: New Ranking System
Reply #94 - Dec 10th, 2021 at 7:23pm
 
I dont mean to sound dismissive. Hopefully theres a way to make it work.

I hesitate to even bring this up as it seems to bring us right back to the beginning but this problem would be solved with the ADI system.

You could simply use ADI to calculate where 4x would have to be to line up with 39. I like the idea a lot. I think it could be fleshed out.

To be quite honest I feel like much better minds than my own have begun to hash out a ranking system or maybe even if there should be one. So ive pulled back a bit. My part in this all was the ADI.
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joe_meadmaker
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Re: New Ranking System
Reply #95 - Dec 10th, 2021 at 7:38pm
 
Morphy wrote on Dec 10th, 2021 at 7:23pm:
I dont mean to sound dismissive.

Not taken that way at all my man.

If something completely different comes out at the end, that's totally cool.  I was just trying to think of something very simple, that could be used by a beginner as well as an experienced slinger.
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Mersa
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Re: New Ranking System
Reply #96 - Dec 10th, 2021 at 8:57pm
 
How about we just use the baleric target,
Score normally and write down our distances.
We could actually backdate channings competition and start handling out ranks .
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joe_meadmaker
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Re: New Ranking System
Reply #97 - Dec 10th, 2021 at 10:15pm
 
How do you see the actual ranking working Mersa?  A predefined set goals to achieve, or just do whatever and we'll use a method to determine a "ranking" based on your distance and score?
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Re: New Ranking System
Reply #98 - Dec 10th, 2021 at 11:15pm
 
I think this still is the simplest. Have to get 5 hits to move on to the next rank. We may all get stuck at one rank, but...

*=1/5 HITS (with cherry picking, one star is not meaningful)
**=2/5 HITS
***=3/5 HITS
****=4/5 HITS
*****=5/5 HITS

League I = 10m
League II = 20m
League III = 30m
League IV = 40m
League V = 50m
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Re: New Ranking System
Reply #99 - Dec 11th, 2021 at 5:20am
 
IronGoober wrote on Dec 10th, 2021 at 11:15pm:
I think this still is the simplest. Have to get 5 hits to move on to the next rank. We may all get stuck at one rank, but...

*=1/5 HITS (with cherry picking, one star is not meaningful)
**=2/5 HITS
***=3/5 HITS
****=4/5 HITS
*****=5/5 HITS

League I = 10m
League II = 20m
League III = 30m
League IV = 40m
League V = 50m

What do you think about the idea of having an unlimited number of stars for each League?
The stars would instead represent consecutive hits.

It makes the system like track and field races, where people compete for 100m, 200m, 400m, etc. and each specific distance is its own little competition.
I think this adjustment to the system makes it less restrictive and more accommodating to ranges people have access to.
With the other system, If you are in an urban area and you only had 10m to sling, you couldn't rise above League I, but this adjusted system would give them the opportunity to score endlessly high at that distance, and become king of the League I hill. Also, for those that prefer longer ranges like 50m, (and have access to them) this system would allow them to compete at those distances.
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« Last Edit: Dec 11th, 2021 at 6:36am by Archaic Arms »  

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Lewis.
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Morphy
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Re: New Ranking System
Reply #100 - Dec 11th, 2021 at 6:32am
 
Archaic Arms wrote on Dec 11th, 2021 at 5:20am:
IronGoober wrote on Dec 10th, 2021 at 11:15pm:
I think this still is the simplest. Have to get 5 hits to move on to the next rank. We may all get stuck at one rank, but...

*=1/5 HITS (with cherry picking, one star is not meaningful)
**=2/5 HITS
***=3/5 HITS
****=4/5 HITS
*****=5/5 HITS

League I = 10m
League II = 20m
League III = 30m
League IV = 40m
League V = 50m

What do you think about the idea of having an unlimited number of stars for each League?
The stars would instead represent consecutive hits.

It makes the system like track and field races, where people compete for 100m, 200m, 400m, etc. and each specific distance is its own little competition.
I think this adjustment to the system makes it less restrictive and more accommodating to ranges people have access to.
With the other system, If you are in an urban area and you only had 10m to sling, you couldn't rise above League I, but this other system would give them the opportunity to score endlessly high at that distance, and become king of the League I hill. Also, for those that prefer longer ranges like 50m, (and have access to them) this system would allow them to compete at those distances.


+1

Theoretically enough consecutive hits at 20 would equal 5/5 at 50m. Thus solving the urban issue.
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Mersa
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Re: New Ranking System
Reply #101 - Dec 11th, 2021 at 8:18pm
 
Like I said before I think the biggest problem is people actually participating.
This makes it less likely to have anytype of leaderboard.
More divisions and options means less people at each league and then In my view less participation.
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Curious Aardvark
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Re: New Ranking System
Reply #102 - Dec 13th, 2021 at 3:18pm
 
Morphy wrote on Dec 10th, 2021 at 7:23pm:
My part in this all was the ADI.

what is ADI ?
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Morphy
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Re: New Ranking System
Reply #103 - Dec 13th, 2021 at 5:32pm
 
Curious Aardvark wrote on Dec 13th, 2021 at 3:18pm:
Morphy wrote on Dec 10th, 2021 at 7:23pm:
My part in this all was the ADI.

what is ADI ?


Its a system that gives your skill level for any series of shots so long as those shots are all at the same distance on the same target. The target can change and the distance can change from one session to the next and you will get a score that will be able to judge across all targets/distances and still be a good approximation of skill level regardless of the target.

Theres a fairly long thread on page one of the main slinging forum called Max scoring accuracy or some such that covers it.
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Archaic Arms
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Re: New Ranking System
Reply #104 - Dec 18th, 2021 at 8:49am
 
Another idea...

# of stars represents number of consecutive hits
(no maximum number)

Short Range - 20m

Medium Range - 40m

Long Range - 60m

For example,
MR 1* = 2 hits in a row at 40m
SR 7* = 8 hits in a row at 20m
LR 4* = 5 hits in a row at 60m

Ideally,
I think Short Range should be 30m, Medium Range 60m, and Long Range 90m, but there would probably have to be adjustments to the target or scoring system to compensate for the increased difficulty.
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« Last Edit: Dec 18th, 2021 at 10:47am by Archaic Arms »  

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Lewis.
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