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Easy sling shotgun technique (Read 3262 times)
Duckhands
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Re: Easy sling shotgun technique
Reply #15 - Apr 7th, 2021 at 4:36pm
 
I did just think of something that could make it work better, and possibly even for split pouches. Just use a capsule, (for lack of a better word) so that when thrown it is all going as a single chunk. At least initially out of the pouch. Then upon rolling out it would dump the "shot" it would have a lot of inertia fall off still, but it could in theory tighten the group, and add a touch more inertial force. Hell for all I know it could just make it preform worse though. I guess I know what I want to test out as a side project lol.... *edit* I just thought of something else to try, a teathered capsule... here me out. It would be a lot like kick's tin can shotgun sling mixed with my capsule idea. Rather than having the capsule firmly attatched to the retention end it would sit in the pouch with a cord tied into the bottom of it with a simple compression lid on it... like a pringles can. So you are actually throwing the can with the lid side as the leading edge. Then have a fixed cord either attatching to the finger loop, or tied onto something nearby. So when it hits the end of the cord the capsule stops abruptly then the scatter shot takes effect and blasts out the front end of the barrel shaped projectile. I am describing it as a pringles can to help visualizing my idea. I would actually probably use a pvc or metal pipe with plastic wrap or parchment paper as the "lid". Idk if I described that concept well, or if it has been done, but could be fun to build and test. If done right the thrown "barrel" of the scatter shot could even impart a spin on the shot... again all in my theory though atm. Testing needs to be done, and documented. This is in the sketch on a napkin phase haha.
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Morphy
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Re: Easy sling shotgun technique
Reply #16 - Apr 7th, 2021 at 4:45pm
 
It might feel like everyones jumping you but we are mostly just thinking out loud on a problem most of us have had. Thats usually the way of it here. One person has an idea and then 15 other people who have run into a problem with that same idea in the past chime in with "great idea but..." usually hoping the current person can fix the flaws in the idea that they couldn't.  Wink Grin
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Re: Easy sling shotgun technique
Reply #17 - Apr 7th, 2021 at 4:49pm
 
Morphy wrote on Apr 7th, 2021 at 4:45pm:
It might feel like everyones jumping you but we are mostly just thinking out loud on a problem most of us have had. Thats usually the way of it here. One person has an idea and then 15 other people who have run into a problem with that same idea in the past chime in with "great idea but..." usually hoping the current person can fix the flaws in the idea that they couldn't.  Wink Grin

I understand that, and I am a bit asburgery lol. I don't intend to look like I am taking offence to this. I actually am taking in all the info, and keeping it in mind, because I figured others have tried this. So I am in a sense trying to glean knowledge. Not meaning to seem defensive haha
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Morphy
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Re: Easy sling shotgun technique
Reply #18 - Apr 7th, 2021 at 5:12pm
 
Naw you dont at all Duck. Most would actually be sounding a bit defensive at this point but you dont. At least not to me. Just want to make that clear so in case it was going in that direction, it doesnt. Hate to lose new good members and all that.
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Re: Easy sling shotgun technique
Reply #19 - Apr 7th, 2021 at 6:20pm
 
Morphy wrote on Apr 7th, 2021 at 5:12pm:
Naw you dont at all Duck. Most would actually be sounding a bit defensive at this point but you dont. At least not to me. Just want to make that clear so in case it was going in that direction, it doesnt. Hate to lose new good members and all that.


Thanks man, I appreciate everyone showing me the ropes of the forum. I came froma pretty hostile hobby group to this so it is a bit refreshing here. In drones everyone tries to chop your head off for everything from battery choice, to propellers, and the brand of motors, escs, flight controllers, vtx's, goggles etc lol. They get HEATED about that crap too. I just fly for fun. So I got out of those forums. I have flown drones for about 7 years now. I am surprised how much I am enjoying slinging and sling making. I enjoy throwing more than shooting, and I got my first .22 at 5 years old.
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Mersa
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Re: Easy sling shotgun technique
Reply #20 - Apr 7th, 2021 at 8:37pm
 
I just wanted to add a little extra information in regards to JudoPs math.

There are a few exceptions to what he has said.
The first is density. 2 projectiles with the same size/surface area with different density will perform different. Heavier doesn’t always mean larger. I know JudoP understands this I’m just adding it for anyone who isn’t as well versed as JudoP. But that leads into the 2nd part and that’s lift, a lighter projectile usually won’t travel as far as a heavier projectile of the same shape and size but there’s a exception and that’s if lift is involved. My best easiest example is a frizbee it’s far from what we sling but the concept is the same , it uses lift to flatten out the trajectory. Think a ceramic plate and a plastic plate , both thrown at the same speed, if thrown correctly the plastic plate will gain some lift and travel further.
I hope I’m making sense.

But seeing as we’re talking shotgun slings were probably talking about “hunting” (a touchy subject on the forum)
So what you really want is density. You want heavier materials
Like you noticed the steel B.B. was better than small stones. Even better is lead , and even better is tungsten. After that we’re talking about throwing nuclear Materials or platinum gold etc. so it kinda capped at tungsten but for the price probably lead.

If we’re talking about just scaling the same material then JudoPs explains it perfectly. 1x100g is better than 5x20g.
But perhaps 1x100g stone isn’t better than 5x20g tungsten. This is where the math gets way harder and I can’t exactly explain what’s best.

Sorry for the rambling
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Re: Easy sling shotgun technique
Reply #21 - Apr 7th, 2021 at 8:51pm
 
Mersa wrote on Apr 7th, 2021 at 8:37pm:
I just wanted to add a little extra information in regards to JudoPs math.

There are a few exceptions to what he has said.
The first is density. 2 projectiles with the same size/surface area with different density will perform different. Heavier doesn’t always mean larger. I know JudoP understands this I’m just adding it for anyone who isn’t as well versed as JudoP. But that leads into the 2nd part and that’s lift, a lighter projectile usually won’t travel as far as a heavier projectile of the same shape and size but there’s a exception and that’s if lift is involved. My best easiest example is a frizbee it’s far from what we sling but the concept is the same , it uses lift to flatten out the trajectory. Think a ceramic plate and a plastic plate , both thrown at the same speed, if thrown correctly the plastic plate will gain some lift and travel further.
I hope I’m making sense.

But seeing as we’re talking shotgun slings were probably talking about “hunting” (a touchy subject on the forum)
So what you really want is density. You want heavier materials
Like you noticed the steel B.B. was better than small stones. Even better is lead , and even better is tungsten. After that we’re talking about throwing nuclear Materials or platinum gold etc. so it kinda capped at tungsten but for the price probably lead.

If we’re talking about just scaling the same material then JudoPs explains it perfectly. 1x100g is better than 5x20g.
But perhaps 1x100g stone isn’t better than 5x20g tungsten. This is where the math gets way harder and I can’t exactly explain what’s best.

Sorry for the rambling

Yeah, that makes sense. I know we all wish we could get some tungsten in bulk haha. I also agree that in most cases 1×100g rock will go further and hit harder than 5×20g rocks, but for the applications range and hit force aren't the only factors. I live where it is legal to hunt certain animals with slings, even clubs, my thought was how people seem to compare slings to fire arms. Everyone knows a 308 will shoot further and hit harder at range than a shotgun, but up close I would rather take the 308 to the chest than 12g bird shot. Ultimately I am just trying to get the most range and power possible out of the shotgun style sling. Those steel bbs hit hard at a surprisingly long range, compared to throwing the same load without the rock on top too. My thought was that maybe the larger heavier rock could cause a small pocket of air lowering the drag for the smaller projectiles behind it. Like a car drafting in a race. Just a thought though. I got a ton of tests to try out
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Re: Easy sling shotgun technique
Reply #22 - Apr 8th, 2021 at 8:13am
 
You don’t see too many snipers using shotguns. It’s silly to talk about long distance energy on this topic. The question in my mind is the practical one: how much energy is retained at the intended target distance (probably not more than 10-15m realistically)?  If it’s enough to get the job done, then it’s useful. Is it ineffective at longer ranges?  That’s good too if there’s things beyond your target that you don’t want to damage. Safety beyond line-of-sight is one of the reasons to use a shotgun instead of a rifle, where the bullet can still cause serious damage kilometers away.

The second question is: is the shot pattern tight enough improve your odds of hitting a target?  If only one of the pellets has a chance of hitting the target anyway, it’s obviously not advantageous to use shot.

If you look at the shot patterns on hunting shotguns, they are usually pretty tight groups.
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“My final hour is at hand. We face an enemy more numerous and cunning than the world has yet seen. Remember your training, and do not fear the hordes of Judas. I, without sin, shall cast the first stone. That will be your sign to attack! But you shall not fight this unholy enemy with stones. No! RAZOR GLANDES!  Aim for the eyes! May the Lord have mercy, for we shall show none!“  -Jesus the Noodler
 
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Re: Easy sling shotgun technique
Reply #23 - Apr 8th, 2021 at 9:37am
 
I think I might go with a shotgun sling for posting my score on the Lets Define Maximum Accuracy thread. Pretty sure I have a chance to whoop you all with a shotty. Grin Cool
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Re: Easy sling shotgun technique
Reply #24 - Apr 8th, 2021 at 10:40am
 
We may have to modify the difficulty index based on ammo cross section too, but that would give even more of an unfair advantage to guided sugar glider ammo
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“My final hour is at hand. We face an enemy more numerous and cunning than the world has yet seen. Remember your training, and do not fear the hordes of Judas. I, without sin, shall cast the first stone. That will be your sign to attack! But you shall not fight this unholy enemy with stones. No! RAZOR GLANDES!  Aim for the eyes! May the Lord have mercy, for we shall show none!“  -Jesus the Noodler
 
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Re: Easy sling shotgun technique
Reply #25 - Apr 8th, 2021 at 1:04pm
 
NooneOfConsequence wrote on Apr 8th, 2021 at 10:40am:
We may have to modify the difficulty index based on ammo cross section too, but that would give even more of an unfair advantage to guided sugar glider ammo


Actually the first part is a legitimate concern. Lead ammo is much more difficult to hit something like a soda can with as opposed to 8 oz stones. It’s like using massive wadcutters. But for now our consistency is poor enough that that is lower on the list of concerns.

What I would really like is to find a good way to limit or get rid of wild misses. Groupings instead of hits I can deal with. Even groupings that aren’t as good as I would like. But geez, throwing a shot 10 feet off the target is just embarrassing.

As for sugar glider glandes I am ok with them even though they are potentially guided missiles. But I think we need to seriously consider some type of Geneva Convention for Sugar Glider Razor Glandes. Where said razors are attached the the Gliders little nubby arms for maximum damage. That’s too much power for one man.
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Re: Easy sling shotgun technique
Reply #26 - Apr 8th, 2021 at 1:14pm
 
Morphy wrote on Apr 8th, 2021 at 1:04pm:
throwing a shot 10 feet off the target is just embarrassing.



+1

And I'm red-faced during most of my slinging sessions! What does that say about my slinging? Does it make me a bad person?
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Re: Easy sling shotgun technique
Reply #27 - Apr 8th, 2021 at 3:34pm
 
NooneOfConsequence wrote on Apr 8th, 2021 at 10:40am:
We may have to modify the difficulty index based on ammo cross section too, but that would give even more of an unfair advantage to guided sugar glider ammo

This and morphy's statemenet litterally made me lol. Their little claws are ridiculously sharp haha, and their teeth  plus their tendancy to leap onto faces I think you guys are onto something there haha
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Re: Easy sling shotgun technique
Reply #28 - Apr 8th, 2021 at 3:36pm
 
Also nooneofconsequence, you hit my thoughts about the shotgun sling on the head. From my testing the spread should improve chances. I want to make some ballistics gell to test the effectiveness, at various ranges.
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Re: Easy sling shotgun technique
Reply #29 - Apr 8th, 2021 at 3:41pm
 
Oh plus my gliders can litterally move faster than my eye can track. They can be on one side of the cage. I blink and they are on the other side hanging from the ceiling, and their wheel or other objects block the only path they seem able to take to that point that quick. When I open the cage to feed them they all rush in and dive bomb to my arms and shoulders then play tag dashing all over me. I probably look emo with my little arm scrathes hahaha
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