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Poll closed Poll
Question: Choose one. Or dont.
*** This poll has now closed ***


Mint Chocolate Chip?    
  2 (10.5%)
Rocky Road?    
  6 (31.6%)
Vanilla?    
  3 (15.8%)
Chocolate?    
  2 (10.5%)
Butter Pecan?    
  2 (10.5%)
Strawberry?    
  2 (10.5%)
Coffee?    
  1 (5.3%)
Sherbet? (Youíre a monster if you choose this.)    
  0 (0.0%)
Pistachio?    
  1 (5.3%)
Frozen Yogurt (Who hurt you?)    
  0 (0.0%)




Total votes: 19
« Created by: Morphy on: Mar 12th, 2021 at 6:02pm »

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Unloved Throws-Question. With Poll! (Read 4513 times)
TOMBELAINE
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Re: Unloved Throws-Question. With Poll!
Reply #45 - Mar 18th, 2021 at 9:28am
 
With the sling on the other side of the head, you create a spring. By bringing back the pelvis, the spring is released. The arm goes forword like a whip.
No need for force.
Another video at maximum speed.
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DSCN4501.MOV (3500 KB | 26 )
 
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Morphy
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Re: Unloved Throws-Question. With Poll!
Reply #46 - Mar 18th, 2021 at 9:59am
 
Very nice Tombe! That looked quite powerful. Iím convinced if the sling/ammo was set up right it could work really good.

On a different note Iíve decided my next thread must be Rocky Road vs Armor
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IronGoober
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...and now, No. 1, the
larch...

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Re: Unloved Throws-Question. With Poll!
Reply #47 - Mar 21st, 2021 at 7:03pm
 
As promised, here is my version of the Apache style throw. With this sling, byzantine style is ~75-80mph, a bit higher if I'm concentrating on speed rather than precision.

https://youtu.be/rNooLVQBusY

Here, for the apache, I was just attempting to not throw over the whole target. You can see I don't raise my arm up very high...but it works. After a bit of practice, I was able to hit my target with this, albeit not as consistently with my other styles that I practice much more regularly.
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John R.
 
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Re: Unloved Throws-Question. With Poll!
Reply #48 - Mar 21st, 2021 at 9:06pm
 
IronGoober wrote on Mar 21st, 2021 at 7:03pm:
As promised, here is my version of the Apache style throw. With this sling, byzantine style is ~75-80mph, a bit higher if I'm concentrating on speed rather than precision.

https://youtu.be/rNooLVQBusY

Here, for the apache, I was just attempting to not throw over the whole target. You can see I don't raise my arm up very high...but it works. After a bit of practice, I was able to hit my target with this, albeit not as consistently with my other styles that I practice much more regularly.


Looks great!

Accuracy might be harder even with further away. Still, it didn't fly up into the air or spike like it did for me, so you're doing something a lot better. Perhaps what I did wrong was having my arm too vertical, where you angled it a lot more. Other demonstrations have kept the vertical throw, which might be why I was doing it so poorly. I wish the original source wasn't so vague.

http://www.prepperuniverse.com/how-to-build-and-use-a-traditional-apache-sling-l...

This brings up the point of how we define terms in slinging. Overhand can often mean almost sidearm to completely vertical. I'm not sure how we would do it, but there has to be a better way to define these terms.
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Re: Unloved Throws-Question. With Poll!
Reply #49 - Mar 21st, 2021 at 9:57pm
 
Also, I've reevaluated "Greek style" again by practicing a bit and experimenting a little.

First and foremost, I still keep my opinion on the modern style of holding it over the head. I have no idea why, but that style is still relatively ineffective for me compared to the other two. The styles I like better are the depictions shown in the art. I'm not sure if this one does. The closest example I've seen is the Makron cup, which if you look at the hand in relation to the head it looks like the throwing arm side style (I have to think of a better name for it).

Naming ideas: "Greek conventional" (sling held on the throwing arm side) and "Greek unconventional" (sling held on the opposite of the throwing side). The "unconventional" doesn't mean it was unconventional historically, if even used at all. Just unconventional as far as modern use is concerned.


First of which I'll cover is holding the sling on the throwing arm side. The example I found was the Etruscan urn ( http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1577297750/9 ). It is also depicted with Heracles slinging at the stymphalian birds (and also probably the Makron cup). This is probably the intended "Greek overhand" that we've tried to replicate (though we can't know if it was only one motion). While the Heracles and Makron cup depictions show more traditional hand positions (in being held back at the distance used today), I tried with arm way back like on the Etruscan urn (which might have only been doing that due to length of the sling). Other than that, standard Greek overhand stuff. Remember to twist your body when throwing, that makes a big difference. Don't leave the stone with only gravity acting on it, that causes the stone to fall out. Overall, I found this style a bit more controllable than the other one, but also a bit less powerful. It has still been redeemed, as it is a bit more comparable with other styles, though I personally am not yet much of a fan.

Second is holding the sling on the opposite side of the throwing arm. This is represented on coins from Aspendos and the Kapra slinging relief. Your slinging arm needs to be held behind your head in order for the sling to be straight. It's and awkward position. Other than that, similar advice. Don't let the gravity work too, and twist your body. However, this one is a faster and more violent movement, and I've found it to be more powerful than the other style. It's a bit harder to control, but still perfectly doable. Unlike with the other style, I felt comfortable in throwing larger stones with it. Personally, I like it more than the previous style, though it makes you hold a weird position.

For the "Greek" style as a whole, it's been redeemed but still has some annoying quirks that will keep it from being one I really love. If I wasn't paying attention, I found that was liable to let the stone fall out. This isn't a problem I really have with other styles. Heavier stones were also harder to get that initial momentum to keep them stable. I also forgot to twist my body quite a bit. It sounds stupid, but other styles it's kind of just built in to muscle memory. I felt here that I needed to make more of a conscious effort to remember to do that. One advantage of Greek style is that you can get off shots fast, but I'm not skilled enough to do that with any accuracy or effectiveness. Trying to do it fast makes me accidentally drop the stone a bit more.
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Morphy
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Re: Unloved Throws-Question. With Poll!
Reply #50 - Mar 21st, 2021 at 10:04pm
 
IronGoober wrote on Mar 17th, 2021 at 11:15pm:
Come on Morphy, show some respect. Wink

https://www.DefinitelyReadThatWebsite.com


...
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Re: Unloved Throws-Question. With Poll!
Reply #51 - Mar 22nd, 2021 at 4:46am
 
The images always follow a stylistic pattern and time frame.  Creating a style out of this is very daring.  In addition, they only see one scene.  No movement.  On the trajan column you can see a slinger with a shield and cloak.  Its stones are in the cloak.  At the same time he is still holding his shield.  That's a strong picture.  Very heroic.  But not very practical.  It certainly wasn't like that.  Of course, you can speculate and try and decide.  It is not logical.
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Re: Unloved Throws-Question. With Poll!
Reply #52 - Mar 22nd, 2021 at 5:23am
 
There are quite effective ways to carry stones within a cloak, I have done this. But I agree that  they way it is depicted there with a shield is odd.
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TOMBELAINE
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Re: Unloved Throws-Question. With Poll!
Reply #53 - Mar 22nd, 2021 at 5:55am
 
Ok with you, Jaegoor.
It's impossible to say that it's like this at this time. We can just say we can throw like this.
Thor Heyerdahl crossed the Pacific on a canoe. It doesn't prove that men tried it before him. He would have failed, it doesn't prove that no one can succeed.
We must test and do not answer by yes or no. If we don't test, who will do it for us ?
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Re: Unloved Throws-Question. With Poll!
Reply #54 - Mar 22nd, 2021 at 5:55am
 
J wrote on Mar 22nd, 2021 at 5:23am:
There are quite effective ways to carry stones within a cloak, I have done this. But I agree that† they way it is depicted there with a shield is odd.


Its hard for me to imagine but im more a visual learner. Do you have a picture of how to do this correctly?
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Jaegoor
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Re: Unloved Throws-Question. With Poll!
Reply #55 - Mar 22nd, 2021 at 7:26am
 
Don't get me wrong.  I am in favor of trying out and trying a lot.  Of course, a lot is possible.  However, I don't think it's right to call it style.  I have no words to properly explain my thoughts.
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Re: Unloved Throws-Question. With Poll!
Reply #56 - Mar 22nd, 2021 at 9:38am
 
Jaegoor, I agree with you.
Define a style is a risky business.
I prefer to set up a situation and ask myself if it works. A hundred brainless screamind and armed charge to me, "Aspendios" works.
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Re: Unloved Throws-Question. With Poll!
Reply #57 - Mar 22nd, 2021 at 11:56am
 
As long as you have something to act as a belt (a spare sling perhaps?), it's easy to make a very effective and large pocket with a cloak. When wearing a Roman tunic, the same thing is achieved when you pull the excess length up to the knees and stuff it down behind the belt. I have both, so I could demonstrate.
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Re: Unloved Throws-Question. With Poll!
Reply #58 - Mar 22nd, 2021 at 12:07pm
 
Archaic Arms wrote on Mar 22nd, 2021 at 11:56am:
As long as you have something to act as a belt (a spare sling perhaps?), it's easy to make a very effective and large pocket with a cloak. When wearing a Roman tunic, the same thing is achieved when you pull the excess length up to the knees and stuff it down behind the belt. I have both, so I could demonstrate.


Is this for me? If so that would be much appreciated.  Cheesy
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Re: Unloved Throws-Question. With Poll!
Reply #59 - Mar 22nd, 2021 at 1:06pm
 
When I waer my historical outfit with cloak and belt and sling the first thing I did was place stones in a pocket I formed. It works well and I think slingers did carry stones in their cloak, but maybe not the way it is depicted on the column. Cloaks are very versatile with many configurations and some result in a perfect stone pocket on me left or right side.
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