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Ma'a Pōhaku (Hawaiian Sling) (Read 4611 times)
TOMBELAINE
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Re: Ma'a Pōhaku (Hawaiian Sling)
Reply #15 - Apr 4th, 2021 at 3:43am
 
I appreciate your work. It is very informative.
And it reminds us that the world is vast.
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Re: Ma'a Pōhaku (Hawaiian Sling)
Reply #16 - Apr 22nd, 2021 at 2:20am
 
Update:

http://www.ulukau.org/elib/cgi-bin/library?e=d-0units-000Sec--11haw-50-20-frames...

http://www.ulukau.org/elib/cgi-bin/library?e=d-0fornander4-000Sec--01en-50-20-co...

http://www.ulukau.org/elib/cgi-bin/library?e=d-0beckwit1-000Sec--11haw-50-20-fra...

Three articles. The first on Hawaiian Warfare and use of the sling, the second the legend of one of our famous chiefs, Lonoikamakahiki. It is also mentioned in the second article that while the use of the sling was mostly associated with warfare, Hawaiians also used it for sport, games and competitions against other slingers or experts in other weapon systems, particularly the throwing spear (mentioned in the third article in the legend of the demigod Kapunohu)

Use the "find" feature in your browser with the word "sling" to easily find sling references within the articles.
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Re: Ma'a Pōhaku (Hawaiian Sling)
Reply #17 - Apr 22nd, 2021 at 3:21am
 
http://www.ulukau.org/elib/cgi-bin/library?e=d-0chiefs-000sec--11haw-50-20-frame...

Amazing online find.

This appears to be the digitized text of one of the most important books used for studies in Hawaiian history. The book is Ruling Chiefs of Hawai'i, to written by Hawaiian historian and scholar, Samuel Mānaiakalani Kamakau.

LOTS of references to slinging and famous Hawaiian slingers (which appears to be the source material for some of the previous articles I referenced).

*Note: some of the stories seem a bit exaggerated or unrealistic, but this is due to these stories evolving into myths and legends over time.
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« Last Edit: May 1st, 2021 at 6:00pm by quentonium »  
 
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Re: Ma'a Pōhaku (Hawaiian Sling)
Reply #18 - Apr 22nd, 2021 at 4:46am
 
Awesome stuff!
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You are a great guy Kick but also slightly scary at times. - Morphy
"Nothing matters, but it’s perhaps more comfortable to keep calm and not interfere with other people." - H.P. Lovecraft, in a letter to Frank Belknap Long, 7 October, 1923
 
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Re: Ma'a Pōhaku (Hawaiian Sling)
Reply #19 - Apr 22nd, 2021 at 5:34am
 
Works like this make me sad for all the history thats been lost forever. Imagine if we had the Library of Alexandria.

Is there any account of shaping slingstones?
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Re: Ma'a Pōhaku (Hawaiian Sling)
Reply #20 - Apr 22nd, 2021 at 6:59am
 
Morphy wrote on Apr 22nd, 2021 at 5:34am:
Works like this make me sad for all the history thats been lost forever. Imagine if we had the Library of Alexandria.

Is there any account of shaping slingstones?


Nothing I have found so far.

I would assume that they were shaped in a similar fashion to other stone based implements, which were generally shaped by hand chipping with other stones. Smoothing and precision shaping would have been done by hand as well, using beach sand and different coarse plant materials as sand paper.

Haven't checked in a while, but you can look into how people hand carve pōhaku ku'i 'ai (poi pounders) and I would assume shaping 'alā would have followed a similar process.
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« Last Edit: May 1st, 2021 at 6:01pm by quentonium »  
 
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Re: Ma'a Pōhaku (Hawaiian Sling)
Reply #21 - Apr 22nd, 2021 at 11:26am
 
Great find.
Haven't read all of it yet, but I found this entertaining piece: "Kemamo, a Kauaʻi warrior, in a contest hurled a sling stone more than six miles. (Fornander, 1918-19, Vol. V, page 224)"
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Re: Ma'a Pōhaku (Hawaiian Sling)
Reply #22 - Apr 22nd, 2021 at 11:27am
 
Yeah I saw that too. Has to be a myth or legend.
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No citizen has a right to be an amateur in the matter of physical training…what a disgrace it is for a man to grow old without ever seeing the beauty and strength of which his body is capable. -Socrates
 
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Re: Ma'a Pōhaku (Hawaiian Sling)
Reply #23 - Apr 22nd, 2021 at 6:16pm
 
Archaic Arms wrote on Apr 22nd, 2021 at 11:26am:
Great find.
Haven't read all of it yet, but I found this entertaining piece: "Kemamo, a Kauaʻi warrior, in a contest hurled a sling stone more than six miles. (Fornander, 1918-19, Vol. V, page 224)"


SerKraus wrote on Apr 22nd, 2021 at 11:27am:
Yeah I saw that too. Has to be a myth or legend.


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« Last Edit: May 1st, 2021 at 6:02pm by quentonium »  
 
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Re: Ma'a Pōhaku (Hawaiian Sling)
Reply #24 - Apr 24th, 2021 at 1:56pm
 
Ok math guys!!! You knew someone was going to ask...

How fast would the release velocity have to be to hurl a stone 6 miles?

Assuming these were big warrior guys who used big warrior stones at hmmm 8 oz, what would be the g-forces on the sling and how much KE are we talking?

If you havent realized where im going with this, I need to know how much harder I need to throw to take out a tank.  Cool
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Re: Ma'a Pōhaku (Hawaiian Sling)
Reply #25 - Apr 24th, 2021 at 2:24pm
 
Morphy wrote on Apr 24th, 2021 at 1:56pm:
Ok math guys!!! You knew someone was going to ask...

How fast would the release velocity have to be to hurl a stone 6 miles?

Assuming these were big warrior guys who used big warrior stones at hmmm 8 oz, what would be the g-forces on the sling and how much KE are we talking?

If you havent realized where im going with this, I need to know how much harder I need to throw to take out a tank.  Cool

Well without air resistance, I believe it would need a release velocity of about 310m/s (1017fps) and the max height of it's trajectory would be about 2400m (7874ft)
With an 8oz projectile, that's ~10900 J

Going six miles with air resistance would require release velocities many times the speed of sound.
Apparently those Hawaiians wouldn't have needed a tassel to make their sling *crack!*  Wink
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Lewis
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Re: Ma'a Pōhaku (Hawaiian Sling)
Reply #26 - Apr 24th, 2021 at 2:50pm
 
Awesome! So if my max Joules was maybe 360ish J it looks like I only need a very doable 10600 more. I may be able to disable a tank but assuming I miss it should probably go through quite a few infantry. If Im using the figure 8 and release too high I may miss the infantry but I believe it would easily take down a fighter jet. All of these scenarios are most satisfactory.
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Re: Ma'a Pōhaku (Hawaiian Sling)
Reply #27 - Apr 24th, 2021 at 6:45pm
 
Morphy wrote on Apr 24th, 2021 at 2:50pm:
Awesome! So if my max Joules was maybe 360ish J it looks like I only need a very doable 10600 more. I may be able to disable a tank but assuming I miss it should probably go through quite a few infantry. If Im using the figure 8 and release too high I may miss the infantry but I believe it would easily take down a fighter jet. All of these scenarios are most satisfactory.


Would a stone with 10600 joules be enough to take out a galley? Maybe that's how we took out Captain Cook and they made the rest up
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Re: Ma'a Pōhaku (Hawaiian Sling)
Reply #28 - Apr 24th, 2021 at 8:29pm
 
I think thats the only reasonable assumption. One can only imagine the amount of damage a projectile going that speed would do. Especially considering it would like have much higher joules due to Albions estimate being based on no air resistance.
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Re: Ma'a Pōhaku (Hawaiian Sling)
Reply #29 - Apr 25th, 2021 at 1:27am
 
Morphy wrote on Apr 24th, 2021 at 8:29pm:
I think thats the only reasonable assumption. One can only imagine the amount of damage a projectile going that speed would do. Especially considering it would like have much higher joules due to Albions estimate being based on no air resistance.


Archaic Arms wrote on Apr 24th, 2021 at 2:24pm:
Morphy wrote on Apr 24th, 2021 at 1:56pm:
Ok math guys!!! You knew someone was going to ask...

How fast would the release velocity have to be to hurl a stone 6 miles?

Assuming these were big warrior guys who used big warrior stones at hmmm 8 oz, what would be the g-forces on the sling and how much KE are we talking?

If you havent realized where im going with this, I need to know how much harder I need to throw to take out a tank.  Cool

Well without air resistance, I believe it would need a release velocity of about 310m/s (1017fps) and the max height of it's trajectory would be about 2400m (7874ft)
With an 8oz projectile, that's ~10900 J

Going six miles with air resistance would require release velocities many times the speed of sound.
Apparently those Hawaiians wouldn't have needed a tassel to make their sling *crack!*  Wink
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« Last Edit: May 1st, 2021 at 4:13pm by quentonium »  
 
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