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Corsican sling (Read 5850 times)
TOMBELAINE
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Re: Corsican sling
Reply #30 - Sep 8th, 2021 at 7:16am
 
Hirtius wrote on Sep 4th, 2021 at 7:29pm:
It probably just goes around the hand as usual

You say : "...probably...as usual..."
You say that the drawing is bad but that my fingernails are not in the right direction.   Undecided
Do you have any proof ? I don't have any more that you do.
My arguments convince you or not, this isn't important.

If Slinging.org wants to be a great forum, members don't must accused of stupids reasoning others members who don't adhere to the unique thinking of the lesson givers.

Positive point : two members have tested. If we are interested by the history of the sling, we must look for.

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joe_meadmaker
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Re: Corsican sling
Reply #31 - Sep 8th, 2021 at 1:08pm
 
I don't think Hirtius is implying that your testing or reasoning are stupid.  The question being posed is just to understand how you came up with the idea that the release cord is held in the way that you're doing it.  Is it based only on the drawing itself?  Or is there something in the description included with the drawing that gave you the idea?

I'm making a bunch of ice balls to do some further testing with this.  I should be able to do this in a couple days.  I've actually got another thought on changing the grip so it uses a finger loop rather than a wrist loop.  It feels a little more comfortable when just swinging an empty sling in my house.  I will record my testing and if there's anything interesting that comes of it I'll put a video together.
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TOMBELAINE
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Re: Corsican sling
Reply #32 - Sep 9th, 2021 at 5:15am
 
My English is not "perfect". So, if I have offended Hirtius, I apologize for it.

With the drawing and the text, it is impossible to decide between the two grip. Objectively.

The sheperds pick up the stone that are on the paths. These screes are rarely good.

The "on the hand" grip is large.  So, it's necessary to test. And the "in the hand" seems to me safer. Furthermore, it works well.

There is no proof to decide. But the test, for me, is a further indication. That's why ma preference goes to a "in the hand" grip.
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TOMBELAINE
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Re: Corsican sling
Reply #33 - Sep 9th, 2021 at 5:21am
 
joe_meadmaker wrote on Sep 8th, 2021 at 1:08pm:
it uses a finger loop rather than a wrist loop.  It feels a little more comfortable when just swinging an empty sling in my house


Does this have to do with the width of the grip ?
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joe_meadmaker
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Re: Corsican sling
Reply #34 - Sep 9th, 2021 at 10:55am
 
I don't think there was any offense.  I think he was trying to figure out what led to your conclusion about the grip based on the drawing.  It's all good.  This forum is spread out so much over the entire planet, I'm surprised communication issues don't happen more often.


TOMBELAINE wrote on Sep 9th, 2021 at 5:15am:
The "on the hand" grip is large.

I agree with you on this.  The grip is very wide.


TOMBELAINE wrote on Sep 9th, 2021 at 5:21am:
joe_meadmaker wrote on Sep 8th, 2021 at 1:08pm:
it uses a finger loop rather than a wrist loop.  It feels a little more comfortable when just swinging an empty sling in my house


Does this have to do with the width of the grip ?

Yes.

Here are some pictures.  Keep in mind I haven't done much testing with this, so I don't know how it will work.

Grip with wrist loop:

...


Grip with finger loop:

...   ...

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TOMBELAINE
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Re: Corsican sling
Reply #35 - Sep 10th, 2021 at 5:04am
 
Joe Meadmaker,
I'm interested in the results of your test.
We are moving away from the Corsican grip but your approach is interesting.
Stay tuned for the continuing story of Corsican grip.  Smiley

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joe_meadmaker
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Re: Corsican sling
Reply #36 - Oct 2nd, 2021 at 10:36am
 
I posted it in the General Slinging board, but I'll put it here to.  Here's my testing with the grip shown in my previous post.

https://youtu.be/cFBfAJpdM0g
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Mersa
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Re: Corsican sling
Reply #37 - Oct 2nd, 2021 at 7:21pm
 
Great video joe.
I’m jealous of your yard
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Razor glandes, Aim for the eyes!!!
 
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TOMBELAINE
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Re: Corsican sling
Reply #38 - Oct 6th, 2021 at 2:12am
 
What I believe :

We have an etnographic drawing and two persons who have tested this style. With a fantastic video  Smiley
It is reasonable to think that the hypothesis is probably ok.

The handle described on the drawing and an underarm throw give a comfortable gesture. My personal feeling.

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Hirtius
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Re: Corsican sling
Reply #39 - Oct 6th, 2021 at 9:59pm
 
But… that’s not what the drawing shows…
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Hirtius
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Re: Corsican sling
Reply #40 - Oct 6th, 2021 at 10:07pm
 
Here is a view with more of the cord. The cord goes behind the hand and over, as shown on the right of the hand.
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TOMBELAINE
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Re: Corsican sling
Reply #41 - Oct 8th, 2021 at 7:11am
 
The one has made this drawing has a master's degree in anthropology. He is a University professor, expert in criminal court, and he wrote a book on the dentition of prehistoric men.
Its drawing is very precise and its purpose is ethnografic.
He didn't write : "held between thumber and index finger" but : "held in tight hand". Words have a meaning.
When throwing, the wrist is behind the hand in Hirtius's hypothesis. And the retention rope becomes too short.
What's why I think that a reverse grip is more likely.


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Re: Corsican sling
Reply #42 - Oct 8th, 2021 at 8:20am
 
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Hirtius
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Re: Corsican sling
Reply #43 - Oct 8th, 2021 at 10:36pm
 
“Held in a tight hand” doesn’t mean it’s held like that. It just means it’s held tightly. He likely wasn’t meaning to describe any method of holding the sling. But more importantly, the drawing doesn’t depict what you are saying.

As for those artworks and this drawing, they most likely shouldn’t be taken completely at face value. They get the general idea, in that the sling is clearly identifiable as a sling, but the artist might not have been familiar with the actual use. I’m guessing whoever is making art in that period probably isn’t slinging. It also might just be a simple mistake. The place where the sling is gripped (look at the thumb and fingers) in the Corsican sling doesn’t make sense for either the conventional or ice pick grip. Although it might represent some undiscovered way of holding the retention cord, it’s probably just an error. It doesn’t really matter since it doesn’t change what’s being depicted. Just because he’s an academic doesn’t mean he’s an artist, though he does pretty well. But he’s not going to get every detail 100% right. The most interesting thing about this drawing to me is the wrist retention cord. That’s a more deliberate detail.

We are all free to think what we want, but I try to base what I think on the most likely interpretation of the evidence. There is exactly no evidence to support this was an ice pick/reverse grip. Upon close inspection, the drawing doesn’t reflect what you are arguing for. You most likely made a mistake, we all do. I’ve openly doubted certain slinging styles only to have to confront that I was wrong. In this case, no one can prove you wrong, but you’re arguing without any evidence. I have my moments where I go against the grain (see the Australian aboriginal thread), but there’s a little bit more to work with in that case. Good luck with whatever you choose to go with.
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TOMBELAINE
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Re: Corsican sling
Reply #44 - Oct 9th, 2021 at 9:06am
 

Hirtius wrote on Oct 8th, 2021 at 10:36pm:
It also might just be a simple mistake.


Hirtius wrote on Oct 8th, 2021 at 10:36pm:
it’s probably just an error.


Instead of talking and saying nothing, you better read what I have writen.
TOMBELAINE wrote on Oct 8th, 2021 at 7:11am:
And the retention rope becomes too short.


On the drawing and the sling of a spanish sherperd late XIXe, the retention ropes seem shorter than the release ropes.

https://i.imgur.com/SMH5BNq.jpg

Do you see  : https://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?action=downloadfile;file=enluminures%2Epdf

I go for holidays but I'll do photos to illustrate my idea.
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