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Roboslinger! (Read 2059 times)
RumorsOfWar
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Re: Roboslinger!
Reply #15 - Apr 13th, 2018 at 12:47pm
 
The "sword swinging robot" from Myth Busters keeps coming to mind the more I hear this being described. They used it again to try to curve a bullet, which is I guess from a movie. If you go to 2:25ish you can see the robot in action... though it doesn't tick off the portable, cheap, or even intuitive check boxes mentioned above, I thought I would share to show a robot that was making the somewhat necessary motion.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5vZ4lCKv1ik

Also to note, like this robot, a use of pneumatics might be practical. I can envision using a bicycle pump to fill a small tank. Most people have access to a bike pump, or one can travel with Roboslinger.
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Scrib

Matthew 24:6 And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not troubled; for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
 
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NooneOfConsequence
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Re: Roboslinger!
Reply #16 - Apr 13th, 2018 at 2:52pm
 
FYI,
I registered roboslinger.org and roboslinger.com for use with the project.  Assuming I set it up correctly, then within 24 hours, those domains should start redirecting to this topic on the forum (depending on when DNS entries are refreshed and updated), so it will be easy to point other people to this discussion here and invite them to participate.  I'll look into some sort of free or low cost web hosting options to put project-specific information up (maybe just use Wordpress.com?) if and when we get to the point of needing more than a bulletin board.
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“My final hour is at hand. We face an enemy more numerous and cunning than the world has yet seen. Remember your training, and do not fear the hordes of Judas. I, without sin, shall cast the first stone. That will be your sign to attack! But you shall not fight this unholy enemy with stones. No! RAZOR GLANDES!  Aim for the eyes! May the Lord have mercy, for we shall show none!“  -Jesus the Noodler
 
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NooneOfConsequence
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Re: Roboslinger!
Reply #17 - Apr 14th, 2018 at 1:36am
 
I guess one of the open questions is: how important is the orientation of the swing arm when the sling is slung?  For some things, 100% vertical is probably ok, and a gravity-based trebuchet with weights would be the simplest solution.

For simulating a sideways or diagonal throwing style, something other than gravity (an air piston, hydraulic piston, rubber band, etc.) might be better, but whatever supplies the propulsion force will need to be characterized for consistency.

One idea would be to attach a cable where the weight would normally go and then place the band/piston/rocket engine/etc somewhere else so that you could pull from any direction through a pulley.  If you did it this way, you could turn the whole trebuchet sideways or tilt it at an angle as needed.



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Basic_trebuchet.jpg (32 KB | 10 )
Basic_trebuchet.jpg
Piston_trebuchet.jpg (42 KB | 20 )
Piston_trebuchet.jpg

“My final hour is at hand. We face an enemy more numerous and cunning than the world has yet seen. Remember your training, and do not fear the hordes of Judas. I, without sin, shall cast the first stone. That will be your sign to attack! But you shall not fight this unholy enemy with stones. No! RAZOR GLANDES!  Aim for the eyes! May the Lord have mercy, for we shall show none!“  -Jesus the Noodler
 
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NooneOfConsequence
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Re: Roboslinger!
Reply #18 - Apr 14th, 2018 at 11:56am
 
ok, roboslinger.com seems to be forwarding to this discussion ok.  I just fixed the .org, so it should start working soon.
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“My final hour is at hand. We face an enemy more numerous and cunning than the world has yet seen. Remember your training, and do not fear the hordes of Judas. I, without sin, shall cast the first stone. That will be your sign to attack! But you shall not fight this unholy enemy with stones. No! RAZOR GLANDES!  Aim for the eyes! May the Lord have mercy, for we shall show none!“  -Jesus the Noodler
 
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NooneOfConsequence
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Re: Roboslinger!
Reply #19 - Apr 14th, 2018 at 12:25pm
 
Thinking about all the different things that need to be designed for roboslinger, here's a partial list.  Maybe people can start taking on individual components that interest them?

Base structure: This can be wood, extruded aluminum, welded pipes, or whatever, but it needs to be stable and rigid.  If it breaks down or folds, then it needs to reassemble and perform reliably when put back together.
It will also need room to put sensors, electronics, batteries etc.
I would also suggest that we mount bubble levels in a couple spots on the base, and maybe have adjustable feet to help with leveling.  Eventually, we might want to put the whole trebuchet on a sled that slides forward as it throws to simulate the forward step.  This would probably not be something to put into the first version though.

Propulsion: There are already lots of ideas and there seems to be a lot of excitement about this particular piece of the design.  It would be nice if we can swap out a big weight, rubber, or a cable that could be attached to an external power source (hydraulic/pneumatic piston or whatever)

Arm: Needs to be rigid and have a strong, reliable attach point for the propulsion mechanism.  We would probably want a rotary encoder on the arm to measure the swing rate.  We may also want some adjustability in the length of the arm and/or the leverage ratio between the propulsion side and the projectile side of the arm.

"hand": this would normally be a simple peg on most trebuchets, but we will probably want to have some options to simulate different finger spacing and maybe wrist rotation.  it needs to be relatively easy to attache a sling that was made for a person to use too.  We may want an electronic release mechanism that allows us to let go at either a specific position or at a specific time.  As far as sensors, we probably want to put at least an accelerometer in the "hand".  We may also want to measure the tension on the sling.

Trigger: By this I mean the mechanism that starts the throwing process, not the mechanism that releases the sling string for the throw.  We will want to pay particular attention to safety.  This needs to be reliable and be difficult/impossible to trigger by accident.  Bonus points if it can be operated from a distance or has some sort of lockout mechanism to prevent accidental release when the sling is being loaded.

Aiming mechanisms:  There will probably be several ways to adjust and aim it, but if it's a 100% vertical trebuchet, then the most annoying one will be left/right rotation. If we don't have some easy mechanism for making small adjustments left or right, then it will be hard to aim, especially on uneven ground.

My vote for Robosling version 0.1 would be a purely vertical trebuchet because of its simplicity. The mechanical design to simulate a sidearm throw would be significantly more complicated, and there are plenty of lessons we can learn with the sensors and propulsion mechanisms on a vertical roboslinger before we start tilting it sideways.

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“My final hour is at hand. We face an enemy more numerous and cunning than the world has yet seen. Remember your training, and do not fear the hordes of Judas. I, without sin, shall cast the first stone. That will be your sign to attack! But you shall not fight this unholy enemy with stones. No! RAZOR GLANDES!  Aim for the eyes! May the Lord have mercy, for we shall show none!“  -Jesus the Noodler
 
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Re: Roboslinger!
Reply #20 - Apr 14th, 2018 at 3:57pm
 
Pure vertical seems a good idea, I'm sure gravity wouldn't be too significant for the basic slinging mechanism anyway.

I'm probably not the guy for practical building stuff, really more of a theorist  Tongue (even if I was I can't have many tools in my rented place).

Happy to give some verbal input on design though.
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Morphy
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Re: Roboslinger!
Reply #21 - Apr 14th, 2018 at 4:25pm
 
To me vertical makes the most sense as well. Probably the majority of things we can test with a very simple design. Im going to focus on supporting the funding aspect of it. All my tools are in storage right now about 1500 miles away so as much as I would like to build the base it would be pretty hard to do.

If anyone has anything they would like to donate or auction please feel free to PM me.

Right now I have the Parang and I'm sure I can come up with more things if I get creative. I have some skimpy pics of me that should net a small fortune for the right buyer. Just FYI gentlemen. They will be going fast.
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NooneOfConsequence
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Re: Roboslinger!
Reply #22 - Apr 14th, 2018 at 9:48pm
 
Morphy wrote on Apr 14th, 2018 at 4:25pm:
I have some skimpy pics of me that should net a small fortune for the right buyer. Just FYI gentlemen. They will be going fast.


The thought of Morphy wearing a traditional Balearic thong will probably haunt me for a week!
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“My final hour is at hand. We face an enemy more numerous and cunning than the world has yet seen. Remember your training, and do not fear the hordes of Judas. I, without sin, shall cast the first stone. That will be your sign to attack! But you shall not fight this unholy enemy with stones. No! RAZOR GLANDES!  Aim for the eyes! May the Lord have mercy, for we shall show none!“  -Jesus the Noodler
 
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NooneOfConsequence
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Re: Roboslinger!
Reply #23 - Apr 14th, 2018 at 10:46pm
 
I could drum up some things to donate too. If any serious money changes hands, then there would need to be a non-profit organization so nobody gets into tax troubles. I personally wouldn’t want the IRS or their overseas equivalents to think the Roboslinger fund was personal income and say someone owes taxes on it. I don’t know how that would work in Europe, but it could definitely be an issue in the US.
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“My final hour is at hand. We face an enemy more numerous and cunning than the world has yet seen. Remember your training, and do not fear the hordes of Judas. I, without sin, shall cast the first stone. That will be your sign to attack! But you shall not fight this unholy enemy with stones. No! RAZOR GLANDES!  Aim for the eyes! May the Lord have mercy, for we shall show none!“  -Jesus the Noodler
 
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NooneOfConsequence
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Re: Roboslinger!
Reply #24 - Apr 15th, 2018 at 9:50am
 
On an unrelated note, I just volunteered for a biomechanics study with a friend of mine.  In exchange for being a test subject for his study, he is going to let me try slinging while I am markered up inside of a motion capture system.  That means we will have some data on the precise motion of a human (me) during slinging.  My form may not be the ultimate example of stone-throwing perfection, but unless someone else has a $100k MoCap system sitting in their garage, my form is all you get Smiley   

The idea is that we will have some information about the 3D movement of a human that we can use to make the roboslinger move in more human-like ways eventually, or at least to be able to say "this is the difference between our roboslinger and how a person does it".

I will try to get several different types of throwing styles in if I can.  I'm sure I won't get everything that everyone would want, and I am even more sure that my form will be off especially for those styles I am not used to, but I'll do my best.

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“My final hour is at hand. We face an enemy more numerous and cunning than the world has yet seen. Remember your training, and do not fear the hordes of Judas. I, without sin, shall cast the first stone. That will be your sign to attack! But you shall not fight this unholy enemy with stones. No! RAZOR GLANDES!  Aim for the eyes! May the Lord have mercy, for we shall show none!“  -Jesus the Noodler
 
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Tomas
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Re: Roboslinger!
Reply #25 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 7:16am
 
This is cool!
I’d there’s something I can do to help please let me know!
I’ll definitely throw in an item for auction too.
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Re: Roboslinger!
Reply #26 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 7:25am
 
NooneOfConsequence wrote on Apr 14th, 2018 at 10:46pm:
I could drum up some things to donate too. If any serious money changes hands, then there would need to be a non-profit organization so nobody gets into tax troubles. I personally wouldn’t want the IRS or their overseas equivalents to think the Roboslinger fund was personal income and say someone owes taxes on it. I don’t know how that would work in Europe, but it could definitely be an issue in the US.


You don't tell them Smiley
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Do All things with Honour and Generosity: Regret Nothing, Envy None, Apologise Seldom and Bow your head to No One  - works for me Smiley
 
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Re: Roboslinger!
Reply #27 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 7:34am
 
The 'throw' will have to be vertical. Without a pre-throw windup, and I have no idea how to simulate that without using an actual robotic arm, you can't do a sidearm throw.

So there's an idea - instead of making a suped up treb - why not make a cheapo robotic arm mounted on an adjustable paltform ?

With the motion capture info, you could accurately simulate throws properly.

https://www.thingiverse.com/search?q=robotic+arm&sa=&dwh=945ad72c437276e

Plenty of designs out there.

The thing is that the vast majority of sling styles rely tottally on the windup to generate power and the only way to replicate that is to make an actual arm, mounted on a powered platform to simulate the waist.

Motors would be the main cost. But you can get some pretty beefy stepper motors. gears are cheap and fairly easy to make (from my point of view). I guess you could use standard arduino boards and gcode to run the throw.

Just makes more sense. 

At the end of the day, we need soemthing that can move pretty fast, but on the positive side we're not using anything heavy at the end of the arm.  

So let's make an actual simulated slinger, rather than something static like a trebuchet that can only replicate the release part of the throw Smiley

You need 4 joints: waist (rotating platform) shoulder, elbow and wrist.
You can use 2020 aluminium strut for 'bones'. Should be a way to make sliding joints to vary effective 'bone' length.
The mechanics are fairly straightforward. It's the software that's the bugger.
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Do All things with Honour and Generosity: Regret Nothing, Envy None, Apologise Seldom and Bow your head to No One  - works for me Smiley
 
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Re: Roboslinger!
Reply #28 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 12:26pm
 
I'm curious, have you already thought of experiments to conduct?  I would like to hear some examples.
what variables will be eliminated by the robot?
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rcoon8865
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Re: Roboslinger!
Reply #29 - Apr 18th, 2018 at 1:10pm
 
Hello.
I'm new to slinging.org. I used to sling as a kid in the
70's-80's and picked it up again a couple of years ago. I
mostly enjoy throwing for distance. Does anyone have
any videos showing or demonstrating sling styles for distance.
thank you.
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