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A "winged" lead glans? DONE! (Read 21022 times)
Mauro Fiorentini
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A "winged" lead glans? DONE!
Jan 31st, 2012 at 8:46am
 
Hallo there people!
I've been to the Archaeological Superintendance this morning, and asked the kind librarian to help me in finding anything related to the sling, used by ancient Romans.
She find a paper in which glandes inscriptions are described; at page 5 there's a picture of a lead glans improved with a couple of bronze "wings".
Here's a small and bad quality picture taken from the pdf I have:

...

The bullet has been found in Cyprus, and I personally believe that it's quite ancient, perhaps IVth Century b.C.?

Sources are:

"S(hort) M(essage) S(ervice) ante litteram - antichi proiettili iscritti e insulti di guerra", A. Naspi and E. Radaelli, inside "FORMA VRBIS" #2, Feb. 2011, Editorial Service System;

"Lead 'slingshot' (glandes)", T. Rhill, inside "Journal of Roman archaeology 22", 2009, pages 146 - 169.
Hope it helps our project Goliath  Smiley

Greetings,
Mauro.
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« Last Edit: Apr 6th, 2012 at 8:19am by Mauro Fiorentini »  

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David Morningstar
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Re: A "winged" lead glans.
Reply #1 - Jan 31st, 2012 at 12:49pm
 

Those have got to be armour piercing blades!  Shocked
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Re: A "winged" lead glans.
Reply #2 - Jan 31st, 2012 at 1:14pm
 
I've never seen anything like it. It's photographs like this that keep me wanting to do more research into slinging.
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Re: A "winged" lead glans.
Reply #3 - Jan 31st, 2012 at 7:58pm
 
How many fins were there? I'm not sure but I would assume that most arrows and darts use 3 fins because it's more stable. If it has only two fins than maybe it was some other purpose? Armor piercing blades would be pretty cool though  Grin
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Bill Skinner
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Re: A "winged" lead glans.
Reply #4 - Jan 31st, 2012 at 8:24pm
 
I wonder what kind of sound it will make when you throw it?
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Re: A "winged" lead glans.
Reply #5 - Feb 1st, 2012 at 5:10am
 
Shocked that's something i never thought i'd see on ancient glans. Thanks Mauro!
i bet they would make a buzzing sound,probably not too much as they seem to be just a tad wider than the gland itself. Quite an effort to make..probably deadlier than the usual and more armor piercing than usual.
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Mauro Fiorentini
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Re: A "winged" lead glans.
Reply #6 - Feb 1st, 2012 at 5:57am
 
I also think it's not so difficult to make.... just wait until the storm we've here in my town passes away, and I'm going to make a couple of these bullets... will show you pictures  Cheesy
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Re: A "winged" lead glans.
Reply #7 - Feb 1st, 2012 at 7:55am
 
they're not fins. Definitely armour piercing - hell even extra deep flesh piercing would be worth the effort.

They look kinda like some of the creations lobohunter comes up with.
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Re: A "winged" lead glans.
Reply #8 - Feb 1st, 2012 at 9:55am
 
I'd also say it's more likely to be an anti-armor round. The increased complexity of the shape just adds more area for air resistance to muck things up, so I think it would be pretty unstable unless thrown in a spiral.

I've actually been wondering about the potential for armor piercing rounds myself, or at least increased penetration rounds. I've been making clay glans for a while now, and I've thought about setting a chipped stone point into the clay at each end. Has anyone tried something like this?
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Re: A "winged" lead glans.
Reply #9 - Feb 1st, 2012 at 7:18pm
 
To quote Rihll:

"Two specimens in the database, both from Cyprus, have lead cores and bronze ‘wings’ from the mid casting line, making them resemble the classic sci-fi-style UFO. These wings would have improved the aerodynamic performance of the glans (acting like an arrow’s feathers, to stabilize the missile in flight) and much improved its ability to penetrate the target, offering cutting edges as well as weight."

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Mauro Fiorentini
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Re: A "winged" lead glans.
Reply #10 - Feb 1st, 2012 at 8:19pm
 
To tell the truth, my opinion is that such wings improve the penetration's power, but also the damage: a winged arrowhead causes a wound as large as its wing's length, so I believe such a glans would act the same way, given that it reaches its target with an angle of 90° or so.
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Mauro Fiorentini
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Re: A "winged" lead glans.
Reply #11 - Feb 1st, 2012 at 8:26pm
 
And another question: how strong are these wings?
Defering to the fact that the impact of such a bullet would be powerful in any case, would these wings resist to the impact?
I believe that perforated wings would allow lead to act as a rivet, thus improving the bullet's overall resistance to impacts.
But since these bullets were to be thrown just once, as I wrote above, their sturdiness was secondary to the damage they caused at the first impact, so I don't believe that casters lose time in piercing bronze wings, not even if this would not be a hard work, due to the poor thickness of the bronze.
It would be interesting to have X-ray studies and metallographic analysis of both the whole glans and the different metals used there!
Greetings,
Mauro.
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Re: A "winged" lead glans.
Reply #12 - Feb 3rd, 2012 at 12:47pm
 
I'd think the wings would cause drag, making the glans hit with the other end forward. The wings might be there to increase the amount of damage the glans caused to soft targets.
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Re: A "winged" lead glans.
Reply #13 - Mar 13th, 2012 at 8:37am
 
Here is one picture of the winged glan, taken in a museum in Cyprus (not by me) :
...
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Mauro Fiorentini
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Re: A "winged" lead glans.
Reply #14 - Mar 13th, 2012 at 8:39am
 
Nice find Caldou!!
So it's different - and much easier to make - than what I thought at first: a piece of copper alloy with (probably) a hole in the middle that will allow lead to spread on both sides!
I've got to make it!!!!!
A Thousand Thanks!!
Mauro.
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