Welcome, Guest. Please Login
SLINGING.ORG
 
Home Help Search Login


Pages: 1 2 3 4 
Send Topic Print
Chinese slingers?? (Read 19398 times)
english
Ex Member


Re: Chinese slingers??
Reply #15 - Jul 17th, 2007 at 5:38pm
 
And for the record, repeating crossbows are more toy than weapon.  Poison is the only thing that could make them really good.  They were used in battle (depictions from the Ming, naval battles, and the Boxer Rebellion), but not as the primary weapons of an army.  Much more powerful single shot crossbows were used, with much longer stocks and in the classical period, more advanced trigger mechanisms than European ones until about the 16th century, when crossbows became sport weapons.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
smgjerald
Descens
***
Offline


Ancient weaponry rules:-)

Posts: 114
Redneck country,Norway:-D
Gender: male
Re: Chinese slingers??
Reply #16 - Jul 17th, 2007 at 6:47pm
 
I am aware that the use wasn´t widespread, from what I read somewhere, they were often used in garrison defenses where masses of attacking enemies was an easy target for the repeating crossbow,much in the same way as machineguns are used today.

Well,they didn´t actually eat the mongols lol,the mongols owned the chinese armies..The mongols conquered them and ruled until the chinese rebelled and threw them out.

I am a big fan of Temudjin(Genghis Khan was his title,means ruler of the world)not so bloodthirsty as rumor has it,but not exactly your friendly neighbouring barbarian either Smiley
Back to top
 

"What the hell are you doing now?"my dad everytime he came home and witnessed my siege weapon projects,the most patient man who ever lived:-)
smgjerald  
IP Logged
 
english
Ex Member


Re: Chinese slingers??
Reply #17 - Jul 18th, 2007 at 6:00am
 
In the transliteration into English it's usually "Temüjin".  The "u" has an umlaut because there are two "u"s in Mongolian - one is more like a back-of-the-throat "o", represented by a "u" in the English transliteration, and one is just like the "oo" in "moo" which is the umlaut u.  And the best way to transliterate "Genghis" is actually "Chinggis".  "Genghis" was used by the first people who were properly investigating Mongol history, who happened to be French - the French pronunciation of Genghis is nothing like the English, but the name stuck in English language texts.
  Transliterating words is an important thing when studying Mongolian or Mongol history.  Most books on Mongol history nowadays have an introduction at the beginning which outlines the sysems used, especially as Persian, Chinese, Mongol, Japanese, Korean, as well as European, sources are used and they all have different pronunciations.

Quote:
Well,they didn´t actually eat the mongols lol,the mongols owned the chinese armies..The mongols conquered them and ruled until the chinese rebelled and threw them out.
Bit of an over-simplification, but sort of true, I suppose.  Actually, though, only a minority of the Mongol presence in China went back to what is now Mongolia in 1368.  Most stayed behind, because it has been almost a century since the first invasion, and they'd set down roots.  And even nowadays, so-called Inner Mongolia has 10 times the population of Mongolia because of a very odd relationship during the Ming dynasty - the Chinese played tribes off against each other, forced some to stay behind the wall, and so on.  I wrote a big essay on it a few months ago.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Curious Aardvark
Forum Moderation
*****
Offline


Taller than the average
Dwarf

Posts: 13965
Midlands England
Gender: male
Re: Chinese slingers??
Reply #18 - Jul 18th, 2007 at 8:55am
 
[quote]And for the record, repeating crossbows are more toy than weapon[/quote]
lmao - which is of course why they used to to fend off pirates and the like ewith them on ships. Or use them on castle walls to fend off enemies.
Every now and then you still keep making these really daft sweeping statements that put the sense you talk into the shadow.
(that's actually a compliment lol)
Once you realise that you probably don't know everything - you'll really get there :-)

If they were of no more use than toys - they would not have used them in battle - it's that simple.
Back to top
 

Do All things with Honour and Generosity: Regret Nothing, Envy None, Apologise Seldom and Bow your head to No One  - works for me Smiley
 
IP Logged
 
english
Ex Member


Re: Chinese slingers??
Reply #19 - Jul 18th, 2007 at 9:22am
 
I'm not saying they can't be used as weaponry, but they still suck.  They jam easily - even the well-made ones - and much more so if you put on even the lightest fletching.  They can't have a powerful prod or they become really slow and difficult to use, they can't have a long draw because then they lose the speed for which they are built, and the friction of the string on the stock (and on some versions, the magazine as well) cuts down efficiency.  The "bolts" (more like darts) can't be particularly heavy or very accurate due to lack of fletching and the need to fit inside the magazine.  You could probably kill someone if you are lucky, and they make good barrage weapons, especially as you don't really aim them, because of the poor accuracy - you could be safely  behind a wall just cranking the lever and not looking where the shots are going and it would still function.  They certainly can't penetrate even the most basic armour - certainly not the seven layers of boiled leather which was standard in the Warring States period - and their only use is as a self-defense weapon, a sort of wooden blunderbuss with much less power.  The first time they were shown in common use was in campaigns against the "Japanese" pirates (the consensus is that they were actually Chinese smugglers, but...) who didn't wear armour; that's not a co-incidence.
  There was a justification for calling them toys, you know.  I didn't say they weren't cool or fun to use, or a great invention.  Just that if you had a powerful single shot crossbow and I had one of those repeaters, odds are that you would kill me first, even at a shorter range.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
smgjerald
Descens
***
Offline


Ancient weaponry rules:-)

Posts: 114
Redneck country,Norway:-D
Gender: male
Re: Chinese slingers??
Reply #20 - Jul 18th, 2007 at 1:37pm
 
of course I oversimplified it,no need to write several pages of why they beat the chinese:) Only mentioned his name because so many thinks genghis Khan was his actual name!
Also aware of the translation problems,but didn´t know this was a grammar debate..AND I am norwegian and have no idea how to translate norwegian grammar to english forexample:  what you call "umlaut" is "Tødler" på norsk Roll Eyes

It was a friend of mine who is half japanese and half-mongolian who got me interested,he is seriously proud of his heritage.

Well,if the other guy had a powerful single shot crossbow and you a repeater with poisontipped quarrels..well,he´d better pray he hit you first Smiley
Back to top
 

"What the hell are you doing now?"my dad everytime he came home and witnessed my siege weapon projects,the most patient man who ever lived:-)
smgjerald  
IP Logged
 
english
Ex Member


Re: Chinese slingers??
Reply #21 - Jul 18th, 2007 at 2:24pm
 
Quote:
Well,if the other guy had a powerful single shot crossbow and you a repeater with poisontipped quarrels..well,he´d better pray he hit you first Smiley
More likely, you'd be praying that the thing doesn't jam, so that you don't have to stick your finger in there and get poisoned by accident, and after that first prayer is over, you'd be praying that your shots hit the target - it is very far from a precision weapon.

Quote:
what you call "umlaut" is "Tødler" på norsk
Smiley What a wonderful word.  I love accents.

Quote:
Only mentioned his name because so many thinks genghis Khan was his actual name!
Well, to all intents and purposes, it was.  Temüjin is quite a common boy's name in Mongolia, whereas Chinggis Khan only refers to the ruler.  The favourite Mongol whiskey brand is "Chinggis Khani Arkhi", Chinggis Khan's whisky.  Temüjin is a name used by a friend of mine in my Mongolian class.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
smgjerald
Descens
***
Offline


Ancient weaponry rules:-)

Posts: 114
Redneck country,Norway:-D
Gender: male
Re: Chinese slingers??
Reply #22 - Jul 18th, 2007 at 3:57pm
 
Quote:
what you call "umlaut" is "Tødler" på norsk


lol, I forgot to return to writing english after writing "tødler",what I write afterwards is "in norwegian" Grin

Well,I dont know the magazine capacity of the crossbow,but if you forexample have 10 shots,you could go completely apeshit on the poor guy Shocked
Well,unless it jams..That would suck Undecided
Back to top
 

"What the hell are you doing now?"my dad everytime he came home and witnessed my siege weapon projects,the most patient man who ever lived:-)
smgjerald  
IP Logged
 
english
Ex Member


Re: Chinese slingers??
Reply #23 - Jul 18th, 2007 at 5:06pm
 
Would, and does.  I suppose you could go apeshit, but while you're doing that, he's taking good aim and shooting you.  With enough power to kill without poison.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
smgjerald
Descens
***
Offline


Ancient weaponry rules:-)

Posts: 114
Redneck country,Norway:-D
Gender: male
Re: Chinese slingers??
Reply #24 - Jul 18th, 2007 at 5:50pm
 
haha,kind of schmeisser vs a sniper rifle Roll Eyes I actually don´t even like the automatic crossbow,in my experience the more advanced=the more bullshit..

As of the mongols,my friend made me drink kumys(yeah yeah,so maybe I didn´t write it correctly:-) a couple of years ago..No wonder the mongols are a hardcore race..you HAVE to be to drink that stuff,urgh Shocked
Back to top
 

"What the hell are you doing now?"my dad everytime he came home and witnessed my siege weapon projects,the most patient man who ever lived:-)
smgjerald  
IP Logged
 
english
Ex Member


Re: Chinese slingers??
Reply #25 - Jul 18th, 2007 at 6:13pm
 
I don't think there is a standard way of writing it - "koumiss" is used often, but I think "qimiz" is seen as most correct by Turkish speakers.  I'm not sure.  In Mongolian, it's called "airag."  It just tastes like sweet yoghurt to me, not bad, but some people hate it.  Mongol tea is the strangest, though.  Salt, lots and lots of milk and some tea cut from a brick.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
smgjerald
Descens
***
Offline


Ancient weaponry rules:-)

Posts: 114
Redneck country,Norway:-D
Gender: male
Re: Chinese slingers??
Reply #26 - Jul 18th, 2007 at 7:10pm
 
He has been talking about talking a trip to mongolia, and I am considering going along, would love to visit Mongolia.

I like yoghurt,but there was something about the taste that was totally repulsing..
we have a type of milk in Norway called Kefir wich is rumored to be developed from kumys.. doesn´t matter though like neither Grin

he said there is another type of kumys,apparently the "super" variation,can´t remember what he called it at the moment.
Back to top
 

"What the hell are you doing now?"my dad everytime he came home and witnessed my siege weapon projects,the most patient man who ever lived:-)
smgjerald  
IP Logged
 
bigkahuna
past-moderator
****
Offline



Posts: 3894
Delaware, USA
Gender: male
Re: Chinese slingers??
Reply #27 - Jul 18th, 2007 at 11:57pm
 
It's called" mares milk currdled with horse piss"!  Grin  I'd rather drink Kava. Grin
Back to top
 

Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day. Teach a man to fish and he will sit in a boat and drink beer all day.
John Walker  
IP Logged
 
english
Ex Member


Re: Chinese slingers??
Reply #28 - Jul 19th, 2007 at 3:22am
 
Quote:
It's called" mares milk currdled with horse piss"!
No piss involved.  Just mare's milk, and a container.  You keep it in a container and stir it repeatedly for a few a day or two, and it ends up slightly alcoholic and a bit bubbly.

Quote:
He has been talking about talking a trip to mongolia, and I am considering going along, would love to visit Mongolia.
I'm heading up to Mongolia next year.  I'll post pictures if I can.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
smgjerald
Descens
***
Offline


Ancient weaponry rules:-)

Posts: 114
Redneck country,Norway:-D
Gender: male
Re: Chinese slingers??
Reply #29 - Jul 19th, 2007 at 3:26pm
 
bigkahuna wrote on Jul 18th, 2007 at 11:57pm:
It's called" mares milk currdled with horse piss"!


I just showed my friend this post and he went ballistic..From his insulted reaction I can guarantee you that there is no piss involved:-)

Pictures would be great,we were actually talking about taking the trip next summer.
considering he´s half mongolian and haven´t been in his homeland for 10 years,he´s very eager to see his homeland again.
Back to top
 

"What the hell are you doing now?"my dad everytime he came home and witnessed my siege weapon projects,the most patient man who ever lived:-)
smgjerald  
IP Logged
 
Pages: 1 2 3 4 
Send Topic Print
(Moderators: Masiakasaurus, Rat Man, David Morningstar, Mauro Fiorentini, Chris, Bill Skinner, Curious Aardvark)