axon50 wrote on Nov 1^st, 2007 at 10:04pm:


Oh, my goodness...
So because the bible tells us not to lie, this means the bible itself by definition has to be true in every little aspect and detail?  
And as a consequence of this most other beliefs are wrong or at least ridiculous?
Do you seriously and honestly mean that?

I remember what made me turn my back on Christianity. It was people thinking and saying things like that...

Oh, man... I´m out of this discussion. (On the other hand, it was against better judgment I got into it in the first place.)


Lasse C

Lasse C wrote on Nov 2^nd, 2007 at 3:35am:



IMO it may benefit discussion in the future, if in response to a previous post consideration is paid to whom you are responding. This may dictate tone and even make remarks made on your part more meaningful. The poster you are responding to is a young man and quite possibly less experienced than you in debating. DesertPilot's response in my opinion is more relevant and constructive and if a correction is to be made it should be done so more toward this manner. In response to your declaration that people who make such statements are what made you "turn your back on Christianity". I would suggest that all walks of life have people who make less than calculated statements, you may have not run into them yet. This is only a suggestion and not meant to single this comment out I am sure it happens a lot and was just a thought. I know this can be a passionate subject.

DesertPilot wrote on Nov 2^nd, 2007 at 12:21pm:


the bible was written about four thousand years ago, and covers about 6,000 years ago, the oldest book that was written from experience was probably about four and a half thousand years old (job), although you'll find that many things in the bible are more acurate then other records, such as the flood, their is a version of the flood in most ancient cultures, but all of them are different, but you'll find that (with all the fossiles all around the world), the global flood is most correct. theirs a little town in the middle east that can track it's hostory all the way back to, i think it's james the disciple, as i have said before abraham apears in muslim history, also the bible is a pretty acurate map of the middle east, the the anchors of pauls shipwrecked ship have been found (they would be the only things that would survive on a wooden ship), i watched a documentary by bob cornuke (he's an archeoligist, not how you spell it) and he went looking for the mount arrerat of the bible, and he found it, it was a cool vid to  , in my opinion, the more truth something tells, the more you can trust that source of information....... a person who tells lies all the time is likely to tell lies, and visa versa.

Woody wrote on Nov 2^nd, 2007 at 4:03pm:


First of all, it´s really nice of you to act as support troops for Axon50. As you note, he apparently is young and rather naïve. Well, if being young and naïve is a flaw, most people grow out of it in time. (But I suppose he and I should postpone any discussion between us until he has... )

When I wrote my reply I was just rather upset (and, I have to say, in my eyes rightfully so) by the deep disrespect he showed towards the billions of people whose beliefs he brushed off as "wrong or ridiculous". I certainly did not mean to belittle him or to show contempt, and if offence was taken, I apologize. None intended.

When I wrote that it was thinking and saying things like that which made me turn my back on Christianity I very nearly adressed Axon50 by writing "people like you" - but that would have been wrong and very unfair. The kind of "teachers, preachers and missionaries" who tell young, easily influenced people like Axon50 that kind of one-eyed intolerant rubbish and to accept it without questioning - they made me turn my back in disgust on Christianity.

One of the few really honest and credible Christians I have met was a PhD in theology, had studied on that famous institute in Dallas, and had even learned to read Ancient Greek in order to read the actual oldest preserved texts from the New Testament without anything getting lost in translation. He had also worked as a missionary in India for many years. (Meaning: We are not talking about an ordinary "thirteen-a-dozen" preacher here, OK?) He was very firm in stating:

Enough said, I think.

Lasse C

axon50 wrote on Nov 3^rd, 2007 at 8:07pm:


Well obviously no christian with a mindset like yours will accept the proposal that christianity is wrong, because if you believe the biblfe word for word it says that you have to believe the bible. Even if definitive evidence was provided on the other side, you would continue to believe what you do. Some call this ignorance, some call it faith, it all depends on what you believe.

However, the Bible has proved hypocritical on many cases. For example, the Bible says that incest is a sin, however the children of Adam and Eve supposedly committed incest, and one could take it to mean all people are related and terefore commit incest. It claims evolution does not exist, but in a world where genes do not exist and change, how do people of different races appear?

Guys, I really think you should all just agree to disagree. Arguments about religion are particularly pointless because they are almost never able to be resolved by reasoned persuasion as interpretations can vary enormously. For example the Bible does not actually say that "evolution does not exist". What it does say is that animals reproduce, "after their own kind". Now some have taken that to mean that absolutely no variation is possible from generation to generation. However, that is their interpretation, which may or may not be correct, based on just four words, which were probably never intended to be submitted to that degree of scrutiny.

Another problem is that the Bible "rules" can vary and be modified from time to time. The example given is that Adam and Eve's children committed "incest" when marrying each other. But the prohibitions against marrying close family were not introduced until Moses' time. Even Abraham, called the father of the faithful, married his half-sister and was in no way criticized for it. Many other incidental rules detailed in the Law of Moses are no longer applicable as is explained in Acts 15 and other places.

Christians need to get to the core issue of Christ's commandments, which is showing the love of Christ to each other and the rest of the world instead of bickering about incidentals and bringing Christianity itself into disrepute. It is a terrible indictment on Christians if people "turn their back on Christianity" because our actions are so contrary to the will of the One whom we allegedly serve.

Aussie wrote on Nov 4^th, 2007 at 12:22am:


very well, i disagree with everyone who thinks that most of the authors of the bible are lyers (i very recently read something like what you said, in a book.) sorry about the arguement but i'm not one to sit back in a biblical argeument or hostorical argeument that i know something about . But i would like to point this out before i sighn of this arguement (hopefully), if the bible is mostly a lie, then why are their so many sucessfull christian archeoligists, doctors, scientists, ect ect (those are the only scientific carrers that i can think of with something to do with science that more than one person that I know of and is an extrimely sucessfull christian, or follows the bible as a guide.)