wow, this topic is in way to many places. and for the third time, why can't we put this to rest. I still disagree with the time it takes to construct a deadfall (I made one large enough to kill a man in under an hour, not using the figure four obviously though  )

As stated in another place. I didn't say it's sick to shoot a bobcat. It's sick to truly enjoy shooting a bobcat that has it's leg clamped to the ground. If you ate the meat, and used or sold the pelt, I don't have a problem with the actual act of killing it, taking pleasure and enjoying the adrenaline rush is the problem.

I wasn't personally attacking your shotgun, I believe that it's very nice and that you are clearly very attatched to it. I was trying to make the point that you're just talking about that shotgun here to make yourself feel and seem manly.  Apparently you didn't understand that point though.


Yes, I do love nature... what's wrong with taking a walk in the woods, may I ask? Sure as hell (ok only slightly ironic expression), I'm not a touristy nature person, with a skewed perception of the reality of the hardships and dispositions of wildlife: the key difference between us is that I have more compassion for animals - take this as you may, and use it to link me to a Yellowstone 'nature nut', or point out the faults in this line of thought, but if you're smarter, you can see this is not true. If you think that it's 'girly' or something to enjoy watching wildlife, I may assure you that you're talking to the wrong people.  Most of this community respects nature as much as I do (not to imply that you don't) , and I have full confidence that you are alone in not being able to enjoy a walk in the woods, up a mountain, or along a beach. Not to drag more people into this, but siguy himself, your new 'bud', recently went on a hike in Conneticut....


And a trivial point whose sole purpose is to discredit you, "if youre over 60 years old i know you were a dope smokin, tree hug...." Do the math more carefully next time...

Don't be so deffensive... it's a fault. Although you may have read it as calling you an 'evil animal killer' that is not how it was meant. Don't judge so quickly or  jump so far to conclusions (look before you leap ); it just makes you sound very insecure and unstable. I know this is somewhat hypocritical, given the reason we're having this discussion, but it's about time that we learned this lesson.

IF YOU HAVEN"T READ ANYTHING ELSE, READ THIS:Try not to be so egotistical and conceeded here, I'm addressing a larger audience as well as you. While this may be a 'personal attack' the things I say are exaturated for the sake of argument. I apologize for twisting some of your words and tweaking perception of you, but it was necessary, animal nature in fact, to fight back.  I know that you'll disagree with this (at first anyway), but in real life we could probably be good friends. So far all that we've talked about, is the one thing upon which we disagree; we've yet to have the chance to talk along common ground. And if you really think about, in essence we are very similar; both appreciate nature, and don't like making animals suffer. It's kind of ridiculous to have gotten caught up on these details, and for the discussion to have escaleted to this point. 

siguy, thanks for being rational and for trying to understand where I'm coming from on this, we could all learn a lot from your example.
In fact, I do know many hunters (some of whom are family), and while I am initially biased against them and skeptical of their motives, many of them are great people whom I respect. I find that in general, they sincerely care more about nature, and are far more realistic about finding solutions, than a typical liberal nut.

Can we got on with life?! I fear that we are both too stubborn, and in a twisted sort of way, are enjoying this too much to just let it die. But it is taking up valuable time. This is not rhetorical: Can we agree to disagree, and move on with positive discussions from which we can learn from each other?

hey engish u callin me a hick