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slings in modern warfare (Read 5789 times)
ZaQ
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Re: slings in modern warfare
Reply #15 - Jul 4th, 2004 at 4:44pm
 
Is is a possiblity of getting it with a fragment.  But unlike a gun a grenade wastes most of it's explosive energy.  As soon as the grenade breaks open the escaping gases take the easiest route possible for expansion.  So the force put into the fragments is not any where near the ull force that could be applied.  Also a grenade laying on the ground doesn't have the blast radius that you would think.  It actually is angled up 15 degrees(I think that correct).  The reason for this its the fragments either bouncing off of the surface or embedding themselves into the surface thus directing the blast slightly upwards.  But you you were it with any fragments I doubt they would break the skin.  however freak things do happen.
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Re: slings in modern warfare
Reply #16 - Jul 4th, 2004 at 10:35pm
 
It seems like it would be less dangerous to tie a short line to the grenade with a toggle and throw the whole thing, since tangling with the sling on release is a real possiblity.
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Re: slings in modern warfare
Reply #17 - Jul 5th, 2004 at 2:22am
 
Like I said, the kid had a grenade in the sling...he must have known what he was doing. Where is that story of the Israeli army officer teachng his men to sling grenades?

Justin
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Re: slings in modern warfare
Reply #18 - Jul 6th, 2004 at 2:59pm
 
Instead of slinging grenades maybe a concussion bomb, but if it falls out on swinging....

Shocked

This is a very violent topic just like my firesling one..

I think grenade launchers are a lot.. er... safer  Grin
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Re: slings in modern warfare
Reply #19 - Jul 8th, 2004 at 12:25pm
 
I didn't want to go into this for obvious reasons, but the Black Books detail one method which would work theoretically. First, you tie a cord around the neck of the grenade. Then, while holding down the spoon (with the aid of some tape or a clamp) pull the pin. Then ream out the pin hole so you can stick a length of cannon fuse (NOT detcord) into it, so it doesn't fall out easily. Then remove the tape - carefully.

Light the fuse and cast the grenade. There is only one cord, so this is the release cord, NOT the retention cord, don't forget! Wink

Never tried it, never will, hope you never do too. But with an inert practice grenade it might be an interesting experiment.
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Re: slings in modern warfare
Reply #20 - Jul 16th, 2004 at 10:42am
 
launching hand granades with a sling sure was done in spanish civil war (1936-1939) my father told me and i've seen some soldiers doing in old reports. Bear in mind a sling was one of the cheap nice d-i-y "toys" spanish kids of the  1900 could play with, so  slings were familiar to lot of soldiers that fought at that time specially country boys , so it's easy to figure out why some of them used slings to increase hand grenade range.
Besides most of the hand grenades in that war  were percussion type, engaged when they were thrown on the air  and loose the safe mechanism while flying towards enemy.... then first hit with something made them blast out. i think this made them more suitable for slinging them  than nowadays fuse granades (i think  a sling projectile can fly far  more  than 5 to 6 secs the fuse lasts speciallly at long range)
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Re: slings in modern warfare
Reply #21 - Jul 24th, 2004 at 10:42am
 
I think I read that the Spanish used STAFF-slings during the Spanish Civil War.  I would never bother to sling grenades at the enemy, mainly because of safety versus tactical alternatives, which are always numerous.  HAND grenades were meant to be thrown or dropped short distances from behind cover, or from indentions in the ground which can be fallen into to provide cover.  They have a fuse with a firing pin mechanism which can ignite with relative small movement of the spoon, whicxh is issued in the U.S. Army with a further safety mechanism in the form of a safety clip, which must be thumbed prior to pulling the pin and releasing the spoon upon dropping/throwing.  A long line could be theoretically attached between the pouch of the sling and the safety clip, and/or the pin, which would haver the bent ends straightened and partially pulled out, but I wouldn't recommmend it!  Too many a sliup 'tween the cup and the lip.  Also, the firing pin can easily flip and ignite the fuse even if the spoon doesn't come off the greenade, and even if it moves partially, a la an old firearm "going off half-cocked"!

You could experiment with dud, or practice grenades, but I wouldn't even do that, as it might encourage someone getting blown up, or launching the thing backwards and blowing someone else up.  If you want a grenade that goes a long way, use a proper 203 or similar model, and then only under legal conditions!  (Bet that Iraqi kid will have a VERY short life span!)
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Re: slings in modern warfare
Reply #22 - Jul 24th, 2004 at 10:46am
 
I think I read that the Spanish used STAFF-slings during the Spanish Civil War.  I would never bother to sling grenades at the enemy, mainly because of safety versus tactical alternatives, which are always numerous.  HAND grenades were meant to be thrown or dropped short distances from behind cover, or from indentions in the ground which can be fallen into to provide cover.  They have a fuse with a firing pin mechanism which can ignite with relative small movement of the spoon, which is issued in the U.S. Army with a further safety mechanism in the form of a safety clip, which must be thumbed prior to pulling the pin and releasing the spoon upon dropping/throwing.  A long line could be theoretically attached between the pouch of the sling and the safety clip, and/or the pin, which could have the bent ends straightened and partially pulled out, but I wouldn't recommmend it!  Too many a slip 'tween the cup and the lip.  Also, the firing pin can easily flip and ignite the fuse even if the spoon doesn't come off the greenade, and even if it moves partially, a la an old firearm "going off half-cocked"!  Doing this type of thing with a live grenade will win you a Darwin Award, or a place with the "WHoories" in "Paradise". in the case of the Iraqi kid, etc.

I nsuppose you could experiment with dud, or practice grenades, to satisfy curiosity, but I wouldn't even do that, as it might encourage someone trying it for real, and getting blown up, or launching the thing backwards and blowing someone else up by accident.  If you want a grenade that goes a long way, use a proper 203 or similar model launcher, and then only under legal conditions!  (Bet that Iraqi kid will have a VERY short life span!)
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Re: slings in modern warfare
Reply #23 - Jul 24th, 2004 at 1:03pm
 
The one i've seen in a historical report used a sling, also sling been used at Toledo's Alcazar  when Republicans surrounded it and held a log time resistance. and sure it was used in manu other places.
May be they used staff slings too or a cord tied to the grenade as in hammer throwing sport or any other ingenuous system to increase hand grenade range. soldiers who fought that war  when they were kids spent a lot of time playing out in the street and fields, a common pastime those days was throwing stones by hand and with sling (no TV, No game consoles no computers Grin)and sure there was a lot of  hand and sling and stone competition  between kids... also (even when i was a kid) stone  wars was  a way to fight with other kid's gangs.
When those kids grew up and fought in the civil war  there was a lot of  experienced  people in launching  stones, so i think  it was a mater of time  that some thought about slinging  hand granades over the enemy if they were out of range with hand, but could reach with a sling. As far as i know there was little or not at alll grenade launchers around
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Re: slings in modern warfare
Reply #24 - Jul 25th, 2004 at 6:41am
 
Good information, Zorrro!  I had read about them somewhere, but have never lived in Spain, and am glad someone here does, and has good knowledge of that historic period!  That all sounds logical.
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Re: slings in modern warfare
Reply #25 - Jul 25th, 2004 at 5:51pm
 
In WorldWar II, Germans had a grenade on the end of a throwing stick, that ended up being called by the GIs a "potato masher" because of it's appearance.  mgreenield
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Re: slings in modern warfare
Reply #26 - Jul 26th, 2004 at 6:32am
 
I think the main two disadvantages when throwing grenades with slings are that at first the lack of cover when slinging, as one has to be standing when slinging and can't lie on the floor (Unless when using a staff sling, perhaps). And if one uses a staff sling, a staff has to be carried or found (and used without testing). The second one is to be sure the grenade goes in the desired direction and not up (as happens to me sometimes), killing the thrower and his colleagues. I have seen the grenades with throwing sticks attached as well, perhaps this helps boosting the range.
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Re: slings in modern warfare
Reply #27 - Jul 31st, 2004 at 7:20am
 
One advantage of using a sling over a grenade launcher is that it's silent, which can be a huge advantage in warfare.  Also, I think a sling could be just as accurate or even more accurate than a grenade launcher.  The great thing about a sling is that you control every aspect of the throw.  You could do a light lob over a building, where as with a grenade launcher, you have the same projection force every time. 

I'm sure you could even modify grenades for slings (or vice versa), so the pin pulls out as it leaves the pouch. 

Chris
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Re: slings in modern warfare
Reply #28 - Jul 31st, 2004 at 3:01pm
 
I have some experience here.  After my stint as a Special Weapons Security Specialist in the armed services,  I sought to develop just such a system.  I used a fairly simple lever release and concho style palm grip anchor to handle inert finned mortar ammo weighing up to 16oz.  Although this system showed great promise in comparison to the M203 grenade launcher which attatches to the barrel of the M16 rifle,  it garnered little interest despite certain distinct advantages.   To the modern professional warrior, our sport is simply relegated to the dung heap of military history.....best forgotten to them, it seems.   A shame, really as the sling has not yet reached it's true potential as a warrior's tool, in my limited opinion.
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Re: slings in modern warfare
Reply #29 - Aug 3rd, 2004 at 1:46am
 
Can someone who knows what they're doing, drag the article/link from "Help me find this article" thread to this thread?

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« Last Edit: Aug 3rd, 2004 at 6:51pm by Chris »  
 
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