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General >> Other Primitive Weapons >> looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
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Message started by little on Jan 31st, 2011 at 10:50pm

Title: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by little on Jan 31st, 2011 at 10:50pm
I think its called a "smatchet" reminds me of a Roman Pugio(dagger) almost,  looks unforgiving for an unfortunate enemy in close quarters with a skilled fighter...
BokerCombatSmatchet.jpg (16 KB | )

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by kuggur slingdog on Feb 1st, 2011 at 7:53am
Not to nitpick, but wouldn´t any blade of that size be pretty "unforgiving", that sucker is almost a foot long, not counting the handle... :o
Is it yours?

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by Masiakasaurus on Feb 1st, 2011 at 8:29am
The Smatchet is a failed invention. It was meant to be a combination survival knife and machete, but it just wasn't big enough to chop tree the way the makers intended. It was still a devastating fighting knife, though.

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by Mauro Fiorentini on Feb 1st, 2011 at 12:32pm
Nice one! And here's mine:



I've forged it this summer, with raw iron; it has somehow become steel and now has a very strong cutting edge.

Overall length is 25 centimeters (9.85 inches), of which the handle is 10 (3.94 inches).
It has been tested on several trees and has proved of being able to chop a 7 centimeters (2.76 inches) diameter tree in about 5 minutes.

The only thing is, that it has a somehow small tang, and hafting it has been a bit difficult; howewer, this handle seems to be solid enough, for now.  :)

Greetings,
Mauro.

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by Bill Skinner on Feb 1st, 2011 at 2:21pm
The story was it was designed by the OSS during WWII and issued to agents in the Pacific as a combo fighting knife/machete/ shovel.  The originals are extremly valuable.  Bill

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by HurlinThom on Feb 1st, 2011 at 2:33pm

Bill Skinner wrote on Feb 1st, 2011 at 2:21pm:
The story was it was designed by the OSS during WWII and issued to agents in the Pacific as a combo fighting knife/machete/ shovel.  The originals are extremly valuable.  Bill

Doesn't appear to be too different from the Army Model 1910 or 1914 bolo, other than being double-edged full length. http://springfieldedge.com/bolo_kinfe_m-1910.html

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by little on Feb 1st, 2011 at 5:00pm
the knife isnt mine,  it looks to be a deadly fighting weapon,  wouldnt use it for bushcraft though,  it has 2 edges

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by Dan on Feb 1st, 2011 at 8:24pm
Defintiely a great figter but not much else, a more readily available, durable, double edged fighting knife is the Cold steel Tai Pan very strong tip as double edged knives go.

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by xxkid123 on Feb 1st, 2011 at 8:38pm
cold steel has a similar knife called the shanghai shadow http://www.knifecenter.com/kc_new/store_detail.html?s=CS80PSS

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by bigkahuna on Feb 2nd, 2011 at 9:28pm
It's suppost to be based on an early Welsh short sword that was copied and given to the machine gunners of the Royal Welsh Fusiliers during WW1.

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by Camo-sling on Feb 5th, 2011 at 2:49am

xxkid123 wrote on Feb 1st, 2011 at 8:38pm:
cold steel has a similar knife called the shanghai shadow http://www.knifecenter.com/kc_new/store_detail.html?s=CS80PSS


Almost looks like a kunai

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by Thunder Chief on Feb 7th, 2011 at 9:36pm
The smatchet was designed by William E. Fairbairn, half of the duo that created the Fairbairn-Sykes fighting knife and helped with the Applegate-Fairbairn knife.  When it comes to close combat, this guy knew what he was doing.

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by Bikewer on Feb 8th, 2011 at 10:37am
When it comes to fighting knives, there are essentially three designs, and this has been true through history.  You have thrusting knives.. Stilletos, daggers, etc.
You have slashing knives like the Arabic Jambiya and the Ghurka Kukri.
And you have knives that try to do both, like the Bowie-type (and many others).

All these types were adapted according to the type of fighting favored by the cultures that developed them.  If you were going to be fighting opponents who were armored, then cutting/slashing blades would not be effective.  You needed to stab, and you needed a sturdy point to get through the armor or chain mail.
Against unarmored opponents (as in civilian combat) a slashing knife could perform well.

The dual-purpose designs are more modern, as a style of combat based on cut-and-thrust was developed (likely based on sword techniques).

The type of knife a soldier would want is considerably different from what a civilian might carry.  The soldier is looking for extreme sturdiness and the ability to penetrate a lot of equipment and heavy clothing and even body armor... He needs a pretty big, heavy blade.
The civilian must (usually) carry concealed and is not worried about heavily-armored foes... However he is often worried about legality.


Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by Rat Man on Feb 8th, 2011 at 11:37am
Totally true, Bikewer.  Also a soldier is very likely to use his knife for a multitude of tasks other than fighting. I have a very old (1906) U.S. Army bayonette that my dad gave me.  I have no idea where he got it.  I don't think that design has ever been improved.. to me it's the perfect blade for a soldier.  I don't have a picture of it, but it's the same as the one below.  Mine is in almost perfect condition with the serial # very clear.  It's a very large, mean, nasty blade.
 It's model 1905, BTW.
Bayonette.jpg (10 KB | )

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by Bikewer on Feb 8th, 2011 at 4:12pm
I have a book from a museum collection of knives and bayonets, and they have a funny story... At one point, the "Little Emperor" Napoleon had his personal guard issued with a particularly long and impressive-looking "sword" bayonet.
This proved troublesome...  At a state dinner, the guard all came to attention and "presented arms", resulting in the extra-long bayonets puncturing the ceiling of the banquet hall....
They were issued more practical items shortly thereafter.

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by little on Feb 8th, 2011 at 5:31pm
I would have to pick between a bowie and a kukri,  hard choice maybe the kukri,  better at chopping wood and flesh as well as an all right point for stabbing.

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by Dan on Feb 9th, 2011 at 9:02am
As much as I love bowies very few have the tip strength you need in a combat situation, the best companies that know their bowies are probably Ontario and Kabar but, they still can't come close to the cold steel tanto point  :) . I have both the the Ontario Spec Plus Marine and also the Recon Tanto and I have a friend with a Kabar and If I need a tool that could bothe fight exceptionaly and punch through an oil barrel I would go with the tanto.

I usually carry my Tanto everywhere with me in the winter months however the best folding and fighting knife I have found is tthe cold steel sparton, very sharp, sturdy, and would work great both stabbing and cutting.

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by Masiakasaurus on Feb 9th, 2011 at 9:47am

Dan wrote on Feb 9th, 2011 at 9:02am:
As much as I love bowies very few have the tip strength you need in a combat situation, the best companies that know their bowies are probably Ontario and Kabar but, they still can't come close to the cold steel tanto point  :) . I have both the the Ontario Spec Plus Marine and also the Recon Tanto and I have a friend with a Kabar and If I need a tool that could bothe fight exceptionaly and punch through an oil barrel I would go with the tanto.

I usually carry my Tanto everywhere with me in the winter months however the best folding and fighting knife I have found is tthe cold steel sparton, very sharp, sturdy, and would work great both stabbing and cutting.

The OKC-3S from Ontario is a bowie with the same tip angle as the Ontario tanto blades. I bought the Freedom Fighter (non-serrated OKC-3S blade on a rubberized Ka-bar style grip) on closeout and have no doubt that it could punch through an oil drum and only have a scratch to show for it.

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by Rat Man on Feb 18th, 2011 at 3:06pm

Bikewer wrote on Feb 8th, 2011 at 4:12pm:
I have a book from a museum collection of knives and bayonets, and they have a funny story... At one point, the "Little Emperor" Napoleon had his personal guard issued with a particularly long and impressive-looking "sword" bayonet.
This proved troublesome...  At a state dinner, the guard all came to attention and "presented arms", resulting in the extra-long bayonets puncturing the ceiling of the banquet hall....
They were issued more practical items shortly thereafter.

I would have liked to have seen that. To each their own.  If push had come to shove I'd have felt better with the bigger blade.  Fortulately, I never had to go hand to hand (or knife to knife) in a battle.  My six years of service were during peace time.. '75 through '81.  
Below is the Cold Steel Spartan that Dan mentions.  It's total length is 10 1/2".  Nice knife.
CSSpartan.jpg (12 KB | )

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by Galvanicfish on Feb 20th, 2011 at 11:48am
I just picked up a Cold Steel Mini Tac Tanto.  I'm quite fond of it. It was advertised as a neck knife, but I think it would be quite obvious under a shirt. I rigged the sheath that came with it with 550 cord so I can carry it horizontally on my belt. My one complaint is that it's a little short in the handle for a proper inverted grip, but other than that it's lovely.
5_266628.jpg (4 KB | )

Title: Re: looks like a very deadly close 1/4s knife
Post by Dan on Feb 22nd, 2011 at 8:13am
Yeah Rat man as full size folding fighting knives go this is one of the best. Right out of the box it had a crazy sharp edge which as Lynn Thompson (the guy who wears the short black shorts, however he is probably one of the best knife fighters on the planet) is one of the most important features and he tells a story of 2 guys getting in a knife fight one of which used his daily utility knife, which he used often, and the other guy used his fighting knife. Both men got many good cuts in but when all was said and done the utility knife guy was cut to ribbions and the fighing knife guy's cuts barely made it past his jacket.

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