Hello, I was wondering if anyone could show me how to make a weaved sling split pouch or not

thanks  :)

http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/9154/weavegc1.png

I would like to see something on that also. Where did you find the photo?

There is a lot on this site already, I'll give you some links:
http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?board=1;action=display;num=1060609211 (reply 4)
http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?board=1;action=display;num=1073633453 (long texts and some info hidden therein.)
http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?board=1;action=display;num=1093816689;start=0 (follow the link to wampun wampist)
http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1093816689/15 (reply 22 has a sketch of how to make the conversion into the pouch.)
http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?board=1;action=display;num=1108791726;start=1 (explanations in words)
http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1153811117/8#8 (several different bits to follow)
http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1120598015 (again a lot of info.)

Hope this helps a bit, (it is likely too much.)

Willeke

Nice looking slings!

The trick with woven pockets is setting up the split and figuring out what to do with any extra strands that you might need. The ones in the Pic are "8" strand pouches, 4 in each side. It looks to me like some of those are dropped, or cut short as the pouch tapers, which is a little tougher to do well. A better alternative might be to just pair the cords and continue weaving.

----tapering part----
1 bundle of 8
2 bundles of 4
4 bundles of 2
----split pouch----
2 bands, 4 strands each
----repeat taper----

Barak Bruard has some very good instructions with lots and lots of pictures, about how to do this. This is for a much more complicated braided sling, but the pouch is similar.

The ones in the picture above look like they might be built on a loop of warp yarns.

Matthias

Amras' pictures in the wiki are probably the best ones we have - I'd forgotten about them :-[

http://www.slinging.org/wiki/index.php?title=Methods_of_making_Slings_%28Modern_and_Historical%29#Puruvian_Sling

Matthias

For those of you that might be interested in making these, here are some photos of a "looped warp" pouch I just made (looks like it takes about an hour)... All one strand (sometimes there is an extra carried along the out warp). ;)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v349/mhborstad/P1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v349/mhborstad/P2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v349/mhborstad/P3.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v349/mhborstad/P4.jpg

These might be good for people who want adjustable cords, or like to use paracord but would like something a little different than the usual leather pouch. Also a very good way to practice up your pouch weaving before tackling a full-patterned braided cord (80% of the work?).

I think that there should be room to even out the taper a bit by stepping down one bundle at a time rather than doubling the strands each transition. Maybe something like:

8
4/4
3/1/1/3
2/1/1/1/1/2
1/1/1/1 - 1/1/1/1

Work just fine the way it is though!

Matthias

Willeke and Matthias, thank you for the links! Now I just need to find the time to try this out. It looks like it takes a bit longer than the braided slings I made.

Edit: And thanks for the pictures. I just saw them after pressing the Post button.

Thanks for all the links and the photos!!
Very helpful. I think I give it a try this weekend.

This is why I love Slinging.org!  There is always something new to learn!  Matthias, I never thought of braiding the pouch separately from the cords.  I just assumed that the way Barak Bruard showed, in his web site, was the way to do it: braid the retained cord, switch to weaving for the pouch, then braid the release cord.  This would be very much faster to do.  And I can combine a woven pouch with nylon cords, or I could braid some cords separately and tie them to the pouch. Thank you!

You can also mix the two ways.
Braid with just 3 or 4 strings, add the pouch this way, using those 3 or 4 strings instead of a few of the loops, and braid the release again.
Thanks Matthias.

Willeke.

Yes - this one actually is a really good candidate for the "loops on a string" type of construction. Glad everyone approves.

I tried the tapered version I brought up above, and it works pretty nicely. I mostly remembered to take pictures this time, so here is a mini-article:

Matthias

Here is the simple loom and twine I'm using. Using a loop of twine instead of just a second peg for the warp (up and down strings ;)) makes it a bit easier to manoever, and you can slacken the warp if it gets too tight. The twine is #18 nylon, and this particular stuff has a slightly sticky coating. Mason twine etc would be suitable, or sisal, braided fishing line, wool...	http://www.slinging.org/images/matthias/woven/WP1.JPG
You need to leave yourself enough twine to do the loops AND all the back and forth weaving (the weft). A good estimate would probably be 5 times the length of the pouch, times the number of warp strands. For this 8"(20cm) pouch, I used about 6.5m, but I ran a tiny bit short and had to compensate - the formula would give you 8m(320"). It's much easier to cut off some extra at the end than to add more! Find the middle of the long twine, and fold that around the hook/peg at one end. Now using both strands, make two loops each. You should end up with 4 loops, giving you eight warp strands, as well as two weft strands at the top of the work.	http://www.slinging.org/images/matthias/woven/WP2.JPG
We're going to carry one of those strands down the side of the pouch until we need it at the split. This does make that side a little thicker, but not enough to worry about. If you *really* want everything symmetric the best I can suggest is to add a dummy cord to the other side to match. You could cut this flush when you're done with it - no need to tie it in as the binding will be more than adequate. Work the other weft strand back and forth, making little figure-eights around the two bundles of warp - 4 on one side, 5 on the other. The key to a good looking weave is to not try to tension the weft at all. The type of weaving we are aiming for is called "weft faced" - when it is done you can't see the warp, the weft strands compact to form an even surface. This type of weaving doesn't have the "basketweave" look that say a placemat might have. It works well for slings because it's tidy. wider than normal, and the load-carrying warp strands are protected from wear.	http://www.slinging.org/images/matthias/woven/WP3.JPG
After an appropriate numer of passes  (8 of so - count the "bumps" on one side) increase the width of the weave by dividing the bundles into 4/1/1/3 (remember that extra one - but try to ignore it). You'll have a bit of a funny transition here, but you can figure it out! You'll notice so far that all of the wraps on each side go the same direction... when we add a strand it upsets the rythm a bit and you'll probably end up with a double row, where the strand you are working with follows the same pattern as before. You can avoid this by switching to the new 3/1 pattern just before you finish the last row, rather than waiting until after. The weft will wrap the opposite direction at the edges, and there might be a little gap, but this way will give you a smoother surface... Try it both ways! You can always back up...	http://www.slinging.org/images/matthias/woven/WP4.JPG
This is the trick to getting a nice tight surface. Weave in the weft relatively slack, and then push it up into the work every pass or so. I'm about to increase again to 3/1/1/1/1/2. The transitions in the body of the pouch were made after 4 back-and-forths, but you could alter the taper to suit the legth of the pouch you are making!	http://www.slinging.org/images/matthias/woven/WP5.JPG
2/1/1/1/1/1/1/1 - 4 rows of this, and then we are ready to split the pouch. Finish with your working strand on the opposite side to the edge with the extra warp.	http://www.slinging.org/images/matthias/woven/WP6.JPG
Aha! Now we have two strands to work with - one for each side of the pouch. The next part is easy, just go back and forth using only the 4 strands on one side until the length looks about right.	http://www.slinging.org/images/matthias/woven/WP7.JPG
Same with the other side!	http://www.slinging.org/images/matthias/woven/WP8.JPG
Joining is easy - just tuck your original weft strand into the edge (don't remember which one it is? Hint: It's the shorter one! ;)). Use the other weft strand to work 4 rows of back and forth over all 8 strands.	http://www.slinging.org/images/matthias/woven/WP9.JPG
Taper the pouch down using the same schedule as the beginning. For some reason this seems easier, but you'll have to figure out the best way to approach each change again to avoid double rows. Once you get down to the 2-bundle stage, lay an extra loop of twine along the edge that doesn't have the extra warp in it (the thinner one), continue weaving, covering that loop as well. We'll use it at the end to pull the tail of the last bit of twine back into the weaving, making a nice strong and tidy finish.	http://www.slinging.org/images/matthias/woven/WP10.JPG
	http://www.slinging.org/images/matthias/woven/WP11.JPG
Almost done! Pull the tail through (you might have to pull pretty hard)	http://www.slinging.org/images/matthias/woven/WP12.JPG
Snip the two tails flush with the surface and you're done! Nice Work! 8-)	http://www.slinging.org/images/matthias/woven/WP13.JPG
Woven split pouches hold rocks very well. The extra width and stiffness makes them easier to handle than braided pockets, and the shape is as good or better than most simple leather pouches. Tie on some bootlaces or braid up some custom cords and go slinging! Maybe next time we'll figure out those fancy-looking peruvian braids?	http://www.slinging.org/images/matthias/woven/WP14.JPG

Most excellent post Matthias!!!!

thx Matthias that should keep me busy for a few hours i think ;D

Matthias,

I built me a rig like yours from a pine board and two cup hooks.  I'm about a third of the way through weaving a pouch.  I am not, of course, getting as clean an appearance as you do, which I attribute to lack of experience.  However, I notice some differences between my setup and your pictures, so I have a question.

You instructed us not to put any tension on the weft, as we work, and I have been leaving that loose (just packing the threads down as I work, with my fingers or a small nail).  However, I did put some tension on the warp before I started.  It appears from your photos, that you did not; the warp threads are rather loose.  Would tensioning the warp threads, cause me any problems?  Would starting over with the warp looser, help?  (OK, I guess that's two questions...)

Dale,
I have not worked with this rig, but I have woven a fair bit.
(And you never know when Matthias will be in next.)

You need a little tension on the warp. It will still work when there is a lot of tension, but when there is no tension it is very hard working.

One way of tensioning is just pressing down the warp when you packing down the weft, which is when you need that tension most.

Willeke

Willeke wrote on Jan 22^nd, 2007 at 5:03pm:

(And you never know when Matthias will be in next.)

HEY! I'm here right now! ;D

It does look looser in the pictures than I remember it being... Normally, for a weft-faced weave you'd want the warp pretty tight, but that does make it a little tricky to work with, and the tapers might be tougher to balance out. Like Willeke suggests, what I did is pull up and back to tension the warp only when I was packing in the next row of weft, which I ended up doing after every insertion. The already-woven sections are almost rigid - they don't need any support.

I'm relying on the packing of the weft for almost all of the structure here. For the first pocket I posted, I waited a few passes before compacting, and it shows in the uneven product. Maybe fingers aren't pokey enough to really settle the weave?

I'll try with some "dry" twine to see if there is any difference. The tack probably helps a bit?

Matthias

Great job with this thread. As usual you guys make the difficult sounding task look easy, and actually make it easy for everyone. Thank you!

Matthias,
Get that Awesome post into the Articles ASAP! Excellent instructions well worth a spot there. Thanks :)

Thanks for the simple instructions. I never thought of weaving the pouch seperate then adding the cords. I have been making many attempts at woven pouches finding myself discouraged with how long it takes or not liking the results. Ihave one braided sling with the pouch woven into the cords. It took a lot of experimenting, and time to make it. But I love the the performance above all of my other slings. I don't know what it is but it has a much better feel to it, like you can almost feel the stone through the cords. Maybe its just me. Thanks anyway this will help a lot.  

Ill try that for sure!
great work Matthias ;)

tryed it ... sucked

I'm bumping this thread because it is cool.  8-)

i would have made one if i knew how to weave like that :(. i can only weave rockmans

I've been trying to figure out how to make a woven split pouch (just a pouch) that you can attach cords to for a while now. Any old cords! I would never have figured it out. I think looped weaving is called bowes?

Thanks for the bump David.  

walter

Iam sure thats a lot harder then he made it look but good info

Sweet! Now I have to make one!

i personally really like the king tut sling that timothy potter came up with.
http://slinging.org/index.php?page=a-method-for-reproducing-a-sling-found-in-the-tomb-of-tutankhamen---timothy-potter

made a few of them.  very nice.
Thanks Potter!

Yeah, that thing is seriously cool. Pretty easy to make too, although I'm not exactly sure on how to make whipping.

echelon7 wrote on Oct 7^th, 2009 at 7:55pm:

i personally really like the king tut sling that timothy potter came up with. http://slinging.org/index.php?page=a-method-for-reproducing-a-sling-found-in-the-tomb-of-tutankhamen---timothy-potter made a few of them.  very nice. Thanks Potter!

Wow! Any you have made of those, get us pics if you can! Remember that I am a short distance from an Egyptian original. The museum would be well impressed to see a reproduction..

I'm in the process of making a full size Tut. It's my 7th attempt, after 6 failures. It gets exponentially harder when you double the ammount of strands.

I did make one perfect one before this out of nylon mason line that was beautiful. The line was so slippery that it dropped rocks, golf balls, tennis balls, etc. Never managed to make it work.  :'(

i think someone made a tut sling with multiple colors- i think regular jute then a bit of died purple jute.

my first actual accomplishment was done with hemp. it worked pretty well. i like it a lot. i sadly have not been able to use it yet and ive had it for weeks.  this was my first time using hemp. its a good material but slightly stiff.  i was thinking of make it next with that nylon mason line but idk now. its an awesome looking sling though.  fun to make.

Gave this loop pouch thing a try and found it a bit more difficult than just weaving a split pouch as you build the sling. Instead of going with the eight inches Matthias used, I tried six and when it was all over with, ended up with a 2 x 4.75" pouch. Most of my slings have that exact pouch length, but I was going for a longer one here.

I also had a hard time getting it symmetric and as you can see, did not succeed. I still think that making up a bunch of pouches might be a good idea. Nothing easier than attaching a couple of cords with a larkshead. Oh yeah, it took me four hours, not one. That could be the learning curve.  Anyway, the next one will be eight inches long and perfectly symmetrical - or you guys won't see it!

http://img5.glowfoto.com/images/2009/10/17-1428197516M.jpg Loop Pouch 1 Wool over cotton

walter

man, I'd be proud to have an asymmetrical one.

The same pouch with cords. I like braiding the cords from the pouch out. No finger loop to braid or weave!  

http://img5.glowfoto.com/images/2009/10/24-1705495961M.jpg

walter

nice, is the pouch restricting in any way? I'm used to my slits being adjustable like rockman slings, or pouches with a wide capability like Aussies

Not too much adjustment there. It's basically just a two inch gash. You can spread it a little, but not too much. Definately not like a Rockman or Aussie split pouch. Tried tennis balls, but lost a few on figure 8's. Lost one rock winding up for my helicopter, but i've also managed that with my other slings.

What I like about this sling is that it is light, fast and I hit more consistently with it than any other except for maybe my reverse twist paracord/leather pouch sling. Don't know why. Like it enough to build another one. This time i'm going to try a larger pouch. Like seven inches so i'll end up with a pouch a little over 6" overall.  

walter

Et cetera pointed out this old thread so now bringing this interesting sling design to the top. Unusual in that the pouch is made separately so if you make a mistake on the cord lengths not all your work is wasted. The link is also included in the FAQ now.

AWSOME!!!!! I gotta try that one  ;D

Aussie wrote on Mar 24^th, 2010 at 5:31pm:

Et cetera pointed out this old thread so now bringing this interesting sling design to the top. Unusual in that the pouch is made separately so if you make a mistake on the cord lengths not all your work is wasted. The link is also included in the FAQ now.

Is it in the guides and articles section?

Et Cetera wrote on Mar 26^th, 2010 at 9:41pm:

Aussie wrote on Mar 24th, 2010 at 5:31pm: Et cetera pointed out this old thread so now bringing this interesting sling design to the top. Unusual in that the pouch is made separately so if you make a mistake on the cord lengths not all your work is wasted. The link is also included in the FAQ now. Is it in the guides and articles section?

Despite my almost superhuman powers as a moderator, putting something in the G&A Section is beyond even me. Also it must be in the form of an article not just a thread. You may of course, suggest it to Chris yourself.

It sure does help to have so many knowledgeable;e people to draw upon for all those things we all want to try..
This blog is almost like a tribe with elders.. and I'm a scrub youth trying to make it in the world..

bump

been thinking about making a separate pouch myself
with maybe d-rings or keyring circles at the ends for quick change to different lengths

i'd like to make a pouch frame/support from a single length of paracord and then weave the paracord

just have to find the right pouch frame/support design

where's my scrap paper ?

ishi wrote on Jul 24^th, 2010 at 10:20am:

bump been thinking about making a separate pouch myself with maybe d-rings or keyring circles at the ends for quick change to different lengths i'd like to make a pouch frame/support from a single length of paracord and then weave the paracord just have to find the right pouch frame/support design where's my scrap paper ?

this already is made from one piece of cord, but not as thick as paracord. not sure if it will work. the method here has the cord looped into 3 large loops, then hooked up. the stray ends are hidden under the weave.

All links are dead


Please reupload

Hello.

I've been experimenting with various sling designs, most of which have been based on tutorials here :)  This one is my favourite so far.

I really like the modular nature of this, as I only started slinging a month or so ago I'm still figuring out the ideal lengths for myself, so being able to reuse the pouch for various length cords and with different release and retention knot configurations makes a lot of sense. Plus if the release cord ever wears out it will be a doddle to replace.

Also I feel like it's possibly the ideal size and shape for accuracy with large or small stones. I started out with more deep shaped pouches, but I feel like these tend to hang on the stone a little more as it exits. The minimal wear pattern I've seen so far with this woven split pouch design seems to suggest that it's a particularly efficient one. No doubt I will be experimenting much more soon enough so I imagine my opinions will change again :P

Here is my latest pouch, the third of this design I've made so far. It is made with 1.3mm dyneema (UHMWPE fibre) with the release and retention cords being 1.8mm of the same material, which I was using for my previous two pouches. When I used the 1.8mm stuff I couldn't seem to manage the weft faced weave and ended up with just a basket weave, which is probably still fine for material of that size and density. For the 1.3mm cord pouch I managed to get the weft facing much better, not quite perfect but I should improve each time I make one. I'm considering getting another reel of the 1mm (I used my previous 31 metres for some previous slings, David Morningstar's Mexican woven pouch) as I'm aiming to get it as lightweight as possible as that seems to feel best to me, the 550 paracord slings I've made so far have felt really heavy and awkward.

https://i.imgur.com/sx6NCKt.jpg

I've mostly gone for the medium length of sling so far, thumb in retention loop with the start of the pouch coming to my shoulder (a way of measuring I got from Luis Pons Livermore in a short bit of documentary on youtube), but for this one I wanted to try something a bit longer, so it's going from my thumb in the loops with the middle of the pouch at the centre of my chest - 35 inches , which also happens to correspond to just under half my height. I've found this length to be one of my favourites so far, tons of power and still reasonably controllable. Firing stones over a small reservoir I'm doing over 150m pretty easily. I don't think I could make it that much longer though, I did try it from thumb to opposite shoulder once and that was quite unusable, but it's probably a case of finding the right technique.

The retention loops there is made with the fairly simple double figure 8 knot - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8n2w4SN5oF8 

The release knot is the "EStar stopper knot" - https://www.animatedknots.com/estar-stopper-knot But with an additional pass down and back up through near the thinnest side in order to even it out and make it a little thicker. I've found it necessary to have a knot that size when casting really large rocks, with a long sling once it gets up to near final speed the amount of pull it has is pretty intense, and dyneema can be a little slippery so a fat knot makes it much easier to hang onto.

Looking forward to trying out many more designs and materials! :)

Thanks very much to all those who've put together all these excellent guides and information.

Nice , I love dyneema

Nice!

That looks awesome!

[Crosspost from my thread in the Trading Post section - http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1567711049, got some new pics and details of my latest slings of this design :)  BTW the sling in my post above was made with 1.3mm, and ended up thinner than the later 'No.3' below, I've given the above to my Dad and he loves it]

https://i.imgur.com/9WG4w52.jpg

Hi. After a bit of experimentation with different sling designs, I've settled on the woven split pouch as my preferred sling. It accommodates large and small projectiles equally well, I find it to be very accurate as it is minimally cupped, it is highly durable not just because of the material I use but also because the cords can be easily replaced and swapped, and it is very easy to keep with you due to the light weight and minimal size. With a small tool like a pocket knife screwdriver attachment you can easily swap between different cords when out in the field, just takes a few minutes.

It is based on the instructions here by Matthias, my thanks to him and others that have contributed in that thread - http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1168848146

For my current favourite variation I weave it from 1mm dyneema, and use 1.8mm for the cords, and 0.36mm for the whipping. The whipping is fishing line that moves from blue to light blue to white and back again, so I use lengths of the particular colours to more easily identify different lengths of cord, white being the longer ranges and blue being close for me.

I've found that the design seems very durable so far, there is minimal wear on the edges of the pouch, which is something I've noticed with more cupped designs. The release cord takes the brunt of the impact, but the 1.8mm dyneema will hold for quite some time, and can be easily re-whipped or replaced. It's quite difficult to cut this stuff, UHMWPE (dyneema is a brand name) is used in artificial joints, so incredibly tough for how light it is. I've put hundreds if not thousands of rocks through the above slings, and apart from the black dye on the surface of the fibres wearing off they really don't seem to be damaged yet, and I expect them to last for a long time yet.

https://i.imgur.com/8D9LzmB.jpg

Initially I tried making this design with thicker cordage, a version with 1.3mm can be seen above (3). Personally I prefer the thinner and more lightweight pouches made with the 1mm. When moving to the 1mm cordage I found that adding an additional warp on each side for 10 total helped to make it wider and compensate for using the thinner cordage. The No.3 with 1.3mm is a little heavier and chunkier, and will presumably last a little longer, and might suit those looking for a heavier sling.

In the top image No.1 is my latest sling using 10 warps, No. 2 is using 8 and is a little thinner. Both work fine generally, but I prefer the slightly wider pouch for a shorter sling and larger ammo, I use the thinner No. 2 for a longer sling and it works great. No. 3 with the 1.3mm is 8 warps.

The measurements for No.1 are: about 35mm in the widest part across in the middle, 16mm width for each split side, the split is about 73mm before the two sides are rejoined, and 170mm long for the whole pouch body. I don't have access to accurate scales, but I believe they are only a few grams with cords attached, maybe around 5 grams or less.

For the retention cord I like to use a double loop knot and put my index and middle fingers through, this is very secure and comfortable. For the release knot I do an 'EStar' stopper knot with a additional pass back up to make it a little thicker and more even to hold.

I can offer it made to your spec; 1mm or 1.3mm pouch, 8 or 10 warps, with or without retention and release cords, multiple cords lengths (I like to do thumb to shoulder, centre of chest, and opposite shoulder), and knots/loops made to your preference and measurements.

I would be very happy to trade for another sling. I have yet to get into more traditional designs using natural materials, so I would love a nice natural sling, perhaps a Balearic or leather pouch, or something woven or knitted. I'd also be happy to exchange for money too. Keep in mind that making one of these is pretty much a full day's work, so considering the time taken and shipping cost of course I'd like a reasonably fair trade, whatever that might be :)

Thanks.

I have a few slings for trade and a whole lot of jute string for making something more specialised if needed :D Those slings look amazing! I'll send a PM :D