Do u think a fire sling would be possible?  In modern day if we got some fire proof cloth we could probably make one.  hehehehe... i'm getting fun ideas!!!!!!!!!  Then we make a "Fireball" by rolling up some cloth around a rock, dipping it in oil and lighting it.  (BETTER SLING FAST)  If anyone tries it, don't get hurt, and sling somewhere safe.  That would be a good seige weapon.  It would be easy to sling it over a castle wall and the ammo is cheap.  Just bring oil and cloth and find rocks.  It could be a good "Anti-Seige engine" weapon too.  Or "Anti-Tank" but in medieval standards.  In the game "empire earth" they should have made the slingers able to shoot fireballs!

Just to add a question? Doesn't the modern day palastinine terrorist use sling to shoot the gas gernade (I don't know how to spell the word mattac cacktail?) to kill people?

Molotov cocktail.

Yes you can fire these with a sling.  Ancient grenades were very similar to this.  Essentially, it is a vessel full of flammable or explosive liquid or powder, with a wick or cloth set alight.  On impact, the vessel shatters, and the flame ignites the contents.

Chris

I suppose you could soak the sling in water beforehand and fire off a molotov cocktail.  A sopping-wet staff sling might be better for the job than a regular sling -- bigger container, more fire.  Of course, once a blaze got going, ancient slingers would only have to fire oil.  They wouldn't have to light it.

man I hate this sign in thing...I posted weeks ago after lurking for weeks, then couldn't post again cause it said someone else was already using my name!,,,

Anyhow, strange you should bring this topic up...a few weeks back there was an item on the news about Iraq, and just off in the background was a kid, maybe 13, holding a sling, with what was obviously a hand grenade sitting in the pouch, lever down.

And...I've been trying a variety of bottles over the last few days...those small 250 ml french stubby beer bottles can be hurled a good distance, filled with water. Petrol, I suppose, will be only a few grams lighter...

Historically, I wonder if anything was flamable enough (high octane rating) to survive being hurled a few hundred feet or yards...I suppose a mini-amphora (sp?) might be a aerodynamic shape.

Jstin

Alcohol was available as well as several varieties of oil.  The even had extremely potent mixtures like greek fire that matches todays fuels.  I think it's defiantly possible.  We know that fire arrows kept alight, and those would be subjected to similar air speeds.  

Chris

I'd agree with the vegetable and animal fat oils, and alcohol found in beer, wine and other fermented drinks, but I'm pretty sure they didn't know about distillation (boiling off the alcohol cooling it and collecting it till much later eg 1500, otherwise we'd have had Romans discussing whiskey)

Quote:

a few weeks back there was an item on the news about Iraq, and just off in the background was a kid, maybe 13, holding a sling, with what was obviously a hand grenade sitting in the pouch, lever down.

Woah, you would sure need to real brass ones to do that.  You have to be very comfortable with the sling, and even then...

hmm, a very interesting idea. However it would be very dangerous and pretty pointless practising this as seiges would be short with the use of air raids. I wonder if this technique was used in bygone times, but i have never heard/read of this tactic being implemented. Does anyone know if it has been used?

I wouldn't want play in that way. It surely is too dangerous. But one can use Christmas sparklers or small petards as sling ammo. They could be embedded in patatos, for example. The effect must be great. I must try it.

Jurek

I have heard of arrows and fire , but do you think the flame could stand the spiral from a sling?? I sling concrete chunks and now and then the spiral dissintigrates the concrete into many pieces. The concrete obviously had some unseen c ra ck s   in it but still--there is a lot of spin on the projectile! Someone needs to find--but I suggest that it NOT be anyone from California with their wind and grass fires >:(

ok guys im not saying i can and im not saying i cant but im gonna try and launch a tennis ball that is on fire into my lake and see if it goes out from the massive spin and whatnot.  also to see if the sling gets very charred

Quote:

I have heard of arrows and fire , but do you think the flame could stand the spiral from a sling??

Arrows spin too, you know.  Especially if you twist the flights around the shaft, which is now common practise for me at least.  I think that the fire would need quite a lot of fuel in order to keep going, but because of the movement through the air, there would be a continuous supply of oxygen.  I think it could last.

wrote on May 15^th, 2004 at 9:47pm:

ok guys im not saying i can and im not saying i cant but im gonna try and launch a tennis ball that is on fire into my lake and see if it goes out from the massive spin and whatnot.  also to see if the sling gets very charred

I was throwing wet tennis balls one rainy night. They flew like comets in the light of lamps, they drew nice tail of sprayed water. Thin fulel must do the same. The spray should blaze very well due to good ventilation. If the speed doesn't blow off (I don't think so) the flame, the the effect should be interesting.
If you are decided to try it, be careful. The sling snap causes the spatter.

Jurek

I think we are thinking along the wrong lines, and the evidence we need is really in front of us...

We know molotov cocktails work, we've all seen grainy news footage of French students in the late 60's, and N Ireland in the 80's. A Molotov cocktail "works" because it transports a combustible substance or liquid, is sufficient volumes, to the destination, as well the ignition method. There would seem to be little point in dousing a tennis ball in petrol, and sending it off to the target, because it carries only a small amount of fuel.

What we need is a volume of fuel in a sufficient quatity that it will ignite the target, and not be used up on the way there, hence the idea about small, stubby French type beer bottles.

Another way, from high school days, is to take an empty co2 cartridge, drill a .22 hole in the round end, plug the base with a dob of solder, then fill with black powder, shot gun cartridge cordite etc, and then press a rim fire .22 blank into the .22 hole. It WILL land bulbous end down, ignite the blank, and the charge inside. Watch for shrapnel.  :oBonus for slingers, they are small and  aerodynamic. This information is for reading entertainment only.  

Fire...
Bomb..
Slings....
;D ;D ;D
I think i have all the moderators worried that i will do some ballistic fireball seige.  It was just an idea  :)

You guys are @*$%*!!* mad.

Seriously.

Typical swaddled Brit...anything slightly dangerous is considered deadly, I mean, the UK is the only country I know where you need a licence and training to use a chain saw.
Justin

wrote on May 19^th, 2004 at 5:09pm:

Typical swaddled Brit...anything slightly dangerous is considered deadly

Calm down my friend. Go and sling some stones - and don't start throwing around stereotyped labels. We can all play that pointless game.

I'm not a 'typical' anything.

;)

Well, we are not used to danger in this country.  In America, you can be driving along a road and maybe hit a moose, with fatal consequences for both driver and moose.  In England, that obviously will not happen.  Or you won't get bitten by a snake that is incredibly mental and poisonous.  Nor will lightning burn you to a thin crisp.  And hey, haven't you heard of the Texas Chainsaw Massacre? ;)  And surely training and a license to use a chainsaw is a good thing, in that accidents will be easily avoided.
 Anyway, I had a little idea about this firesling idea.  I was watching an advert for Grolsch, you know, "it isn't ready yet"...  I noticed the fact that the bottles had little metal pieces for opening the beer more easily.  I thought that you could either:  Turn it into a molotov and loop string through the metal thing and then hurl it like a bolas, or possibly put the loop on the hook of a staff sling and swing it forward, hurling it further, like a bolas thrower.  I will practise (I am sure I have some grolsch somewhere.)  I guess any bottle will do, but the little metal thing on the Grolsch bottle would work so well.  Anyway, that was just a little idea.

English,

I don't think the stopper retaining gizmo would hold up to the stress when launched like that. Also I'd hate to use my bottles to test that do to the fact that they are great for filling with my home brew wines and stouts (by themselves they are not only almost flamable and also tasty 8) ).... Might be more fun to make a peace offering with the mead, get the opponents passed out drunk,and then attack in the middle of the night with a small band of guys with chainsaws(or maybe just sharpend spoons, big sticks and slings used as garrets).
There is more than one way to de-hair a feline.

;D

Um... Sharpened spoons??  That's just forkin' wierd, man.

I think regular 'Molotov' (where's that term come from, anyway?) cocktails just use stuffed rags as stopper, wick, and fuse.  

Hobb... "may the sporks be with you"  ;)
As far as who started  flinging incendery ammo or where the name for the fire bottles came from is not realy clear to me... I'm starting to think that "Greek Fire" was a gelled alchol based napalm. Anyone who has tasted Grappe I'm sure would agree...

not sure about this but I though the name moltov cocktail from russia or germany?? i dont know if i am right though.
Sean

i no th molotov cocktail was in vented by the russian weapins scientist , molotov during ww2 to combat the panzers. also they trained dogs torun uder tanks but it back fired wen the dogs ran back under their own tanks cos thats wat they wa trained with! funny and sad.

Invented no, named yes. Anyone can stuff a rag in a container full of fule and the idea is far older than WW2 IMHO... There was a trick I learned for making the stem section on clay pipes. That was to take a smooth dry stick and mold the clay around it and leave it in place when the pipe was fired. The stick would burn out in the process... The same trick might work for making hollow glands... I'll have to fool with the idea this weekend and fire back a report(couldn't help the compound pun).  ... For that matter the same could be done with wax... Either way run for cover folks i want to try something ;).

I was actually threatened by someone with a sharpened (plastic) spoon.  I laughed.
I am sure the stopper thing on the bottle would be able to withstand such torment.  Besides, it is one use.
I think that the Molotov Cocktail, in the modern sense, was invented during the Spanish Civil War.  I have just been reading a book on said conflict, and it mentions the first use of such incendiary devices.
Grappe is possibly the most disgusting alcoholic drink I have ever tasted.  "Fire Water".  I believe it tasted to me a bit like watered down industrial alcohol.
Not entirely sure of the naming of the device, the Molotov, but I have actually used one (this may sound very weird, but we have an insane science teacher.  He helped us make some very interesting things.  Once, a flour bomb broke one of the gas taps at the school.  Also, one of my friends (he is American, from Tennessee in fact) makes little explosives using sugar and fertiliser, inside two tin pie containers with a piece of cardboard separating the two substances and a pin as a detonator.  He blew the wheels off a wheelie bin).  Anyway, at least none of that is as extreme as what was shown on the (superb) documentary film "Bowling for Columbine":  a young guy was interviewed and asked about the "Anarchist's Handbook", or some such thing.  He said that he had only recently made a "few gallons of napalm".

Hey, check the little flag thingy (beside this thread on the board page)!  This thread is now listed as a "very hot topic."  Of course, I thought the site administraters were supposed to stop 'flame wars.'  Hee hee, I'm on fire today!   ;D

O.K., sorry, I'll stop now. :-[

Might have posted this before, but here it is again.  A staff slinger firing a grenade (likely similar to a Molotov cocktail).  This would have broken on contact and caused fires.  This was a common practice in naval battles of that period.  Fire is a ships worst nightmare despite having water all around them.  Greek fire, in particular, was noted to be resistant to water.  Dowsing the flames with water only spread the fire.  

http://www.slinging.org/images/BattleSandwich2.jpg

Chris

cool pic Chris, looks like the archer also is launching a smilar device.

Very cool pic!  I wonder why the... bombs(?)... aren't depicted as being lit.  Did they send the fire over afterward?  Coat the boat with oil & then send over the torches?

Yes, I believe so.  They would fire these in addition to flaming arrows (or similar).  

Chris

That makes a fire-sling easier, then.  No need to worry about the cords catching fire.  Just lob over some breakable bottles of something flammable, then send over some hot coals wrapped in something that it takes a second to burn through, but not wrapped tightly enough to keep out all the oxygen.  You have to group your shots, but if they were as good as we think they were in Roman times, that wouldn't be a problem.

Ones durring the nautical travel on a sailing yacht, we had the "great problem". The people on the second boat had a cold beer in the refrigerator... we didn't have. The sun was broiling us... The boats weren't able to come near each other due to rather big waves. The pally crew offered to send us a few bottles. I started to prepare the line in order to throw the one ending to them. The distance between the boats was about 6-8 yards. Suddenly the crazy friend from second boat shouted - Cath! - and started to throw the heavy bottles. I quickly abandoned the line and started to catch them one by one. There was the four bottles and luckily all of them survived that risky transportation. Consider we both were standing on the rocked decks without a help of the hands. It was a stunt and normally I wouldn't decide to try or repeat it. But we were so thirsty that I was catching these beers like my own children  ::)

That reminiscence came to me durring looking Chris' picture. Maybe those guys are doing the same  ;D

Jurek

Of course, it could just be a proto IRA trick..throw a bottle of petrol in the front door of a pub, ignite a zippo lighter, wrench the lid off so it doesn't close and put out the lighter, then throw in the zippo. Zippos survive being thrown, and the busted bottle has had a few seconds to spread its flammable liquid. I still think the Iraqi 12 year old with the grenade in a pouch is still the best image I've seen though.

Of course, one could sling a signal flare.

Any more ideas on the potato/12 gauge device?

OOh i got an idea. what if you took a tennis ball  cut a slit in it filled it with some flammable liquid then got waxwire and lit it launched it with your sling and what would happen. It is definately a good idea to try it in the city NOT lol. In other words i wont be trying it anytime soon Be careful.  :o



I hope this hasnt been thought of already

-Tommy-

My whole state's too flamable to try any of this stuff!  >:(  
But in regard to the sling singing it might by useful to know that Borax solution makes fabric fire-resistant.

A friend has his FFL license and a publication call the Shotgun News had adds for shotgun shells called Dragon's Breath that blasted out a stream of fire.  

with the idea about a soaked flammible tenis the flames would fling about and land on the thrower tommys idea would work make some homemade naparm polystirieen disolved in lighterfluid and fill a tennis ball or iv heard of tennis balls filled with match heads or take a small bag put a lead ball in it then load with match heads (non-safty) cut the top of a tennes ball put the bag in fill with the above mentioned napalm stitch it back up seal with latex or wax or somthing or just a tight plastic bag .Make sure you start with a slow wind up. my grandad once told me if you scrape of the matchhead into a airgun pellet and seal it with wax they explode on impact and are good for shooting at night. any way thats me over and done with by for now

If a person used the tennis ball idea and used gelled diesal or homemade napalm (i have heard gasoline and strofoam mixed together?). Then take the caps on a roll that every kid uesed in there cap gun. Wrap the caps around the tennis ball then throw it. Be carefall if you try this. Maybe you should do more research before you do this!

Soon we'll have the BATF or whatever they are or the FBI checking us out as a       ist organization ;D

Although I know this is unecessary I just have to say it.  Any experimentation with incendiary projectiles requires extreme caution and forethought.

We just had another wild-fire start in the Bosque near Albuquerque.  In the past these have usually proven to be started by kids with fire-works.

People around here have definately lost patience with anyone tossing fire whether it be cigarette butts or firecrackers.  There is even talk of resurrecting the old west practice of lynching.

Any pyro-technic slinging should probably done over water.  Since there are only 2 mud puddles left in the state that leaves me out.

Ditto for Colorado.  We're just coming out of a drought, and we're still smarting from the wildfires 2 years ago.

http://www.xinventions.com/main/pyro/home.htm

Roll your own.