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Rhodian Slingers, Xenophon and Mithridates (Read 5368 times)
Lugh-Lamhfada
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Rhodian Slingers, Xenophon and Mithridates
Apr 6th, 2013 at 2:32pm
 
Came across this,http://books.google.ie/books?id=z1kbyWNJIt0C&pg=PA9&lpg=PA9&dq=persian+slingers&...;

On page 9 it recounts how the Persian slingers outranged the greek peltasts and Kretan Archers and it is recognised that there are Rhodians amongst them who can sling lead. I know this episode has been discussed before but this particular passage has not.

It sounds as if the Rhodians in the Greek army were not serving as slingers, but as some other type of unit, but mentions that many of them carry slings already. Strange that it is known they are good slingers, already carry slings and can sling lead yet they are not armed and used as such.
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Thearos
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Re: Rhodian Slingers, Xenophon and Mithridates
Reply #1 - Apr 6th, 2013 at 4:10pm
 
The Greek mercenaries were hired by the Persians as shock infantry-- one of the units in which the Achaimenid army was deficient. Slingers and archers, the Persians had in great numbers. It's part of a passage where the Greeks, stranded in Mesopotamia, have to invent all kinds of expedients to make themselves into a multi-functional army: they also improvise cavalry. Yes, the Greek command buys slings off people who have them, and pay others to braid slings. They used sinews they found in villages, and also took lead and cast bullets.
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Re: Rhodian Slingers, Xenophon and Mithridates
Reply #2 - Apr 6th, 2013 at 4:30pm
 

I'd love to know how they found enough lead to arm 200 slingers during an overnight stop in a random town/village. I am guessing it was used there for roofing and guttering. For example, 200 slingers x 50 bullets x 35grams = 350 kg of lead. A worthy subject for a learned monograph, perhaps?
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Thearos
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Re: Rhodian Slingers, Xenophon and Mithridates
Reply #3 - Apr 6th, 2013 at 7:13pm
 
There are two schools of thought on this. One, by Pierre Briant, argues that this stuff is from strategic stores of the Achaimenid army, along with bowstrings, which the Greeks plaited into slings. The problem is that lead bullets are not attested for the Persian army-- that's specifically what Xenophon says. (Of course, sling bullets do turn up in Tissaphernes' name; the argument then would be that the Persians adopted sling bullets after fighting against Greeks--Tissaphernes was the western satrap with lots of experience of fighting Greeks, and specifically led cav. against the Ten thousand). See P. Briant, History of the Persian Empire, on this.

The other view is that these are not bowstrings, but sinews; not lead for bullets, but artisanal. Picked up in a number of villages. Is known as one of the metals for artisanal stuff. Not used for roofing and guttering (I would guess Mesopotamian houses have flat roofs sealed with pitch, or reeds), but for vessels, often very large.
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Lugh-Lamhfada
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Re: Rhodian Slingers, Xenophon and Mithridates
Reply #4 - Apr 6th, 2013 at 7:49pm
 
Mentioned also is that Persian slingers had a lesser range than the Greek ones. Im assuming they used smaller slings and large stones? They cant have been uniform or standardised, being drawn from from probably dozens of subject peoples and allies. Id say that body of slingers was a sight to see. Arabs, Medes, Hai, Kurds, Mesopotamian etc all in native dress with differing slings and styles.



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Thearos
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Re: Rhodian Slingers, Xenophon and Mithridates
Reply #5 - Apr 6th, 2013 at 8:26pm
 
(the passage has been discussed a few times before). They sling large stones (hand-filling stones). They are local forces under a local commander, so perhaps Iranian levies or levies from modern N. Iraq-- this is not the invasion of Greece ca. 480.
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Jabames
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Re: Rhodian Slingers, Xenophon and Mithridates
Reply #6 - Apr 11th, 2013 at 5:17am
 
I've read that the Ten Thousand often cannibalized some hoplites and cavalry to serve as ranged units;  whether as slingers or other missile troops to have a better combined arms advantage.  Interesting to see Hellenic forces like this in their development from solely heavy infantry,  to a diversified effective force like that mercenary army.
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Thearos
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Re: Rhodian Slingers, Xenophon and Mithridates
Reply #7 - Apr 11th, 2013 at 6:14am
 
They were all heavy infantry, the cavalry units and slingers were created out of them, multi-tasking army. There also are light infantry in Cyrus' army which are not Greek, and which must have tagged along when the Ten Thou marched west.

May I recommend the Anabasis to everyone as one of the most interesting texts out of the ancient world ? There is a volume of essays on it R. Lane Fox, The Long March: Xenophon and the Ten Thousand, which is quite good.
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Jabames
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Re: Rhodian Slingers, Xenophon and Mithridates
Reply #8 - Apr 11th, 2013 at 6:23am
 
Ive read it before,  they had something around 11,000 hoplites and about 2,000 light troops.  They were dwindled down to about 6,000 over time.
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