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Video Analysis of a Tennis Ball Flight (Read 9843 times)
Yurek
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Video Analysis of a Tennis Ball Flight
Jun 16th, 2012 at 11:50am
 
I always wanted to know how fast we sling and how the air drag changes the speed of various projectiles. As far using a camera I was able to calculate average speeds at given distances at the best. The average speed actually doesn't say much about how fast you launches a projectile and how fast it hits a target - especially when we are talking about tennis balls, that are affected by the air drag very much. Lately inspired by a Slingermedia's video and having in my hands a better (not very good one) camera I did deeper "researches" of a video. As a result I got some interesting numbers and charts.

First, a few very short words what and how I did.

1. I filmed from the side a few shots with tennis ball against a steel door. I used my regular 75 cm long sling and several somewhat worn-out tennis balls. The shots were of moderate power. They were like in my regular slinging for accuracy. The camera was located symmetrically 28-29 m from the line of slinging. The distance between the point of the releases and the door measured with a measuring wheel as 86 feet, what is 26,2 in meters.

2. Using the Audacity I chose the shot that had the shortest time of flight.

Here is the video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJooCQldw0M

3. Using a video and graphical program I got a picture with marked location points of the tennis ball in each frame, where measured precisely each section between the marked points in pixels.

http://i0.simplest-image-hosting.net/picture/trajektoria.png
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4. Using a spredsheet and knowing both the real slinging and the camera distance, corrected the parallax errors of each section - because of the camera looks at the sections at various angles and actually they are longer then the measured from the picture.
Next, knowing the frame rate of the camera (30fps) and the all needed lengths either in pixels or meters, I calculated the average speeds of the ball between each frame and assumed that they were momentary speeds in the middle times between the frames. In this way I got a series of the speeds together with corresponding times.

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5. I put the results into a plotting program, where I did a "curve fitting" for them.

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Sounds short and simple. Actually it took a while to find some tools and put it all together Smiley
Anyway, finally I got I wanted the most Cheesy A nice pretty accurate chart that says a lot about a flying tennis ball.

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I got more interesting charts from the first one. I am going to share them in next posts.


Yurek


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« Last Edit: Jun 19th, 2012 at 1:26pm by Curious Aardvark »  

In the shape, structure and position of each stone, there is recorded a small piece of history. So, slinging them, we add a bit of our history to them.
 
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scoteeball
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Re: Video Analysis of a Tennis Ball Flight
Reply #1 - Jun 16th, 2012 at 12:43pm
 
Wow Yurek. Nice job. I’m impressed !  I went to college and professional school, studied physics and a bit of calculus. Unfortunately a lot of it went in one ear and out the other.
 
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Morphy
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Re: Video Analysis of a Tennis Ball Flight
Reply #2 - Jun 16th, 2012 at 2:23pm
 
First, Yurek you sling those tennis balls fast... Yikes.  Second, isn't it amazing how quickly they lose speed? I would love to see how tennis balls compare on average to stones and lead glandes for how quickly each loses velocity to drag.  Maybe one day we can get all that data together.  Great job on this Yurek.  Very interesting stuff.
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Re: Video Analysis of a Tennis Ball Flight
Reply #3 - Jun 16th, 2012 at 6:26pm
 
Fascinating!

I too am surprised at how fast the ball loses velocity. 10% loss in the first 1/10 of a second  Shocked
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Re: Video Analysis of a Tennis Ball Flight
Reply #4 - Jun 16th, 2012 at 9:01pm
 
Beautiful work. I've realized from practical experience that tennis balls lose speed very rapidly. Extrapolating the graph shows why it's virtually impossible to sling a tennis ball 100m.

I was going to say that the flight of the ball would be the same whether launched from a sling or struck by a tennis racket. Of course that may not always be true as tennis players usually put a lot of spin on thir shots. This alters the flight path but may not actually affect the rate at which the ball loses speed.



BTW It was very interesting to see the slow motion of you slinging from the side view. Perhaps you could post another video so we can better see the details of your style.
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Re: Video Analysis of a Tennis Ball Flight
Reply #5 - Jun 17th, 2012 at 3:48am
 

Parallax corrections? Thats taking it seriously! Very well done Yurek  Cool
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Re: Video Analysis of a Tennis Ball Flight
Reply #6 - Jun 17th, 2012 at 5:09am
 
This is great stuff, Yurek.

I've tried to get data like this and failed to get anything satisfactory, so it's wonderful to see some clear results.

Eyeballing the gradient of your curve to get the deceleration at the beginning, it looks like close to 50m/s2. That puts it at five times the acceleration due to gravity, and suggests a terminal velocity (where weight matches the drag forces) at  51/ sqrt(5), of  about 23m/s.

This is amazingly close to the drag predicted for a sphere with the size and weight of a tennis ball, and suggests the ball behaves like it has a drag coefficient of about 0.5  even at the high speed of launch, no evidence of the 'drag crisis' at least. If anything, it looks from the continuation of the graph like the effective drag coefficient decreases as the ball slows down, although perhaps that is the trajectory of the ball?

Can't wait for further experiments! Smiley
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Re: Video Analysis of a Tennis Ball Flight
Reply #7 - Jun 17th, 2012 at 11:10am
 
I appreciate your effort for calculating all this.Great job Yurek! also 51 m\s with tennis balls and a 75cm sling shows,that you have a very powerful\fast slinging style which i know already Cheesy but it's good to know the exact numbers too. I'm not surprised that the tennis ball looses velocity this quick.
I'm very curious what launch speed would you get from a long sling~120cm or what you'd use for distance with thin cords and very small pouch,and very aerodynamic lead glandes (of your prefered weight).About 80m\s to max 90 m\s would be my bet.
At 30m they wouldn't loose speed,maybe like 1m\s,but they hold their speed amazingly good.Even after 300-400-500m they still hit very hard.
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Re: Video Analysis of a Tennis Ball Flight
Reply #8 - Jun 17th, 2012 at 12:18pm
 
That's some serious speed for a tennis ball! Cool stuff and well done.
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I was pretty good at slinging like 10 years ago.
 
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Yurek
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Re: Video Analysis of a Tennis Ball Flight
Reply #9 - Jun 18th, 2012 at 9:37am
 
Thank you guys for the interest and appreciation. I tried to do it as accurate as possible to get close to real numbers. I believe the results are  fairly accurate. I also would love to have similar results for stones and lead glandes. I hope I will do it one day, but in this case I will need to find a new place and have a few glandes. However, as Jlasud wrote, a change speed of lead glades at a similar distance would be too small to get accurate results using the equipment I have used. For stones it still could work, but maybe they would need to be covered by bright paint.

It would be great to do these experiments jointly and to gather all results in a one place. Some of us probably have easier access to a good place, good stones, lead glandes or a good cam coder. All we need is a good footage, exact measured distances and a bit of willingness. What do you think about it?

Aussie,
I have read somewhere that spin changes drag coefficient of tennis balls, but don't remember how.
I checked velocities of tennis serves and looks like most of tennis players would be happy having so fast serves. We have also to think about a slinging tennis not only slinging golf  Grin
By now I don't have the camera and I am not able to film my slinging from the side. But if it could be helpful, I may to put on youtube a slow motion fragment from my recent slinging in front of the camera, but it is more a rear view. Anyway, if I get the camera again I will try to remember about you.

Wanderer,
Great to have you here. Your ability of eyeballing of the chart is impressive. Actually the 50 m/s2 is ca. at 0.07 s, you were very close. According to my charts the terminal speed is about 35 m/s. I am going post them all and your interpretations will be welcome, others too, of course. The tennis ball we talking about seems to generate a smaller air drag then others I used. I have data for an another one and I am going to compare them later. 

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In the shape, structure and position of each stone, there is recorded a small piece of history. So, slinging them, we add a bit of our history to them.
 
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Yurek
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Re: Charts 2, 3
Reply #10 - Jun 18th, 2012 at 10:15am
 
The last chart I posted is the most important as is a base for all other ones. But I think more intuitive for most of us is an information how the speed changes along the trajectory.

Chart 2
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Chart 3
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You can read from the charts that when you going to destroy a target with a tennis ball, it is much better to approach close and sling gently than sling hard from a bigger distance, not mentioning accuracy. I have to shorten my practice range Grin
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In the shape, structure and position of each stone, there is recorded a small piece of history. So, slinging them, we add a bit of our history to them.
 
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Re: Video Analysis of a Tennis Ball Flight
Reply #11 - Jun 18th, 2012 at 11:33am
 
With smooth,round stones and lead glandes, I personally wouldn't bother calculating the speed drop at this distance.It would be negligible. Their average velocity at 30m would be plenty interesting. I remember about 40m\s for ~150g stones and ~70m\s for lead glandes with about 1m long slings at 20m,average velocity.My tests were much less precise just orientative.
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Yurek
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Re: Video Analysis of a Tennis Ball Flight
Reply #12 - Jun 18th, 2012 at 6:38pm
 
Great results Jlasud. You most probably right, but maybe it would be worth of a try to test stones. We could increase the distance, stones can fly fairly flat at 50 m or more. But in this case a good camera would be needed to see the stones.

Next two charts about deceleration of the ball due to the air drag:

Chart 4
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Chart 5
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Just after the release a deceleration of the ball is bigger than 6g - quite impressive.  There is a strange inflection of the curve at ca. 0.07 s. But I don't think it is due to the "drag crisis". Most probably it is due to overall accuracy of the method... or maybe not?

Next charts tomorrow, time to the bed.
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In the shape, structure and position of each stone, there is recorded a small piece of history. So, slinging them, we add a bit of our history to them.
 
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Re: Video Analysis of a Tennis Ball Flight
Reply #13 - Jun 18th, 2012 at 8:06pm
 
As far as stones and lead glandes go, (no pun intended) I haven't measured the effects of drag directly but I did compute range with drag factored in. I had a marginal mean velocity of around 43 m/s, which would fly 187m without any drag. With drag the calculated ranges were 170m for lead biconical, 147 and 146m for lead spherical and clay biconical, and 104m for clay spherical. Most stone will be slightly denser than the air-dried modelling clay I used, so the range would be somewhat greater.

The calculated deceleration due to drag at a given velocity allows comparison to the tennis ball data. All are given at ~43m/s
lead glande - .651m/s/s
lead sphere - 1.20m/s/s
clay glande -  2.70m/s/s
clay sphere -  4.50m/s/s

Note that spherical objects have lower drag coefficients at higher velocities, so the lead sphere and clay glande deceleration numbers even up rapidly once the velocity drops slightly.
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Re: Video Analysis of a Tennis Ball Flight
Reply #14 - Jun 18th, 2012 at 8:13pm
 
In regard to spin's effect on drag I remember reading on the NASA education pages (and I think in their FoilSim program) that if the spin is generating lift then there is some lift-induced drag, but I don't know how to calculate that.
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