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Peruvian question (Read 1768 times)
Whipartist
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Re: Peruvian question
Reply #15 - Feb 11th, 2012 at 12:57am
 
paleryder wrote on Feb 6th, 2012 at 10:03pm:
I'm making plans for the coming season that I want to make. I'm geting back in the swing of things and will take my time. Eventually, I would like to make a Peruvian style sling. I'm a little confused because sometimes the are spoken about as if they have a core of fibers around which the braiding occurs while at other times it seems there is no core, just the braiding.

I saw on-line instructions for the 8-round braid around a core and some information on a 16 strand with no core.

Would someone educate about the difference? Are both authentic in design? I have a friend whose mother is from Ecuador. I would like to impress him with a sling made from Alpaca wool. I want to do it right. Thanks.

Todd


Braids can be done in several different ways.  Peruvian sling braiding is done in the hand.  It's a crossing technique.  The strands are divided into 4 sections forming a cross shape, and then the strands are literally crossed at the top of the fist, where the 4 sections combine together.  The work emerges slowly below the fist.  Usually 16 or more strands are used for elaborate braids.
 
The use of a core in a sling braid only has one real purpose and that is to provide a 3rd color to an otherwise two color braid.  So if you are alternating white and black diamonds, you can throw white into the core for a section in exchange for some red, and proceed to do red and black diamonds.  Most of the Peruvian patterns only work with two colors since you are working with 4 sections which combine together.  If you try to put another color in, the patterns don't look right anymore and become random looking even through they are still ordered.  So alternating colors is a better option and a core comes in handy for that.  In braids of 24 strands, 3 colors or more can be used and still the patterns come out right.  Cores also make braids slightly thicker than they otherwise would be, without adding durability.   

The core usually won't work if it contains more than half the amount of strands in the outer braid because gaps begin to form in the braid. 

If you're just going to work with 8 strands, it's easiest to braid off a hook on the wall, as is done in whipmaking, using the 4 strand braid as seen in the picture posted by xxkid, or by doing an 8 strand braid in 4 seam.  But it isn't authentically Peruvian to do that, and the braids are of a different character. 

Braiding off a hook is certainly easiest and quickest once it's learned, but braiding off the top of the hand is a different type of thing entirely and makes more beautiful slings in my opinion.

To finish a sling braid, a tassle or wrap of somesort is usually best.  It will generally need repair from time to time.  I just quit the braiding and take a separate strand and tie it on with half hitches for about an inch or so.  I go all the way down to the end and then pull off the extra forming a sort of popper which cracks when the sling is used.  It continues to slowly pull off as it wears but provides a nice place to hold during use, and once it comes off completely, I just replace it. 

Here are a few of my slings.
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IM007768.JPG (455 KB | )
IM007768.JPG

And David put his hand into his bag and took from it a stone and slung it, and struck the Philistine on his forehead.  And the stone sank into his forehead, so that he fell on his face to the ground.
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paleryder
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Re: Peruvian question
Reply #16 - Feb 11th, 2012 at 2:22am
 
Whipartist,

Wow, beautiful slings. I've made prayer ropes before after watching a video and those knots are a little complicated. I wish there was something like that for making the Peruvian sling from start to finish. Ever thought about doing a DVD on how you make your slings. I might be an investor! Smiley

I've done a four strand round braid before with eight strands although I never moved onto the pocket. What did you mean when you wrote, "8 strand braid in 4 seam."

I've looked a little at some on-line demos of the upbraiding. I think I can figure that [part out...maybe. Beginning the whole thing and transitioning to the pocket will present some problems for me. I have no idea what to do.

Thanks for your advice.

Todd
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Jaegoor
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Re: Peruvian question
Reply #17 - Feb 11th, 2012 at 4:40am
 
Very nice Slings.

I also work with pleasure in this manner.

Best I use silk.
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Re: Peruvian question
Reply #18 - Feb 12th, 2012 at 12:45am
 
I recommend Roderick Owen's book on round braids "250 Patterns".  I own many braiding books and his is the best for teaching how to do Peruvian braids. 

4 seam is also called the "cow tail" braid.  It's the plait used on the thongs of cattle whips because it allows for a very flexible thong with minimal interweaving so that the strands in the overlay may overlap.  If you check out a post of one of my bullwhips in the thread on whips in the other weapons section of the forum, http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1310542042 you'll see its use in 24 strands using two colors.  The strands cross eachother's paths in 4 places around the circumference of the braid, and these form seams, which in quality work remain straight and go down the sides of the braid.  In the case of the whip, this is apparent because I used a black and tan contrast.  A 4 seam braid can be done with any number of strands above 3, but whenever the strand # doesn't divide into 4 equal parts, the distance between the seams becomes slightly uneven.  Hence in braids of this sort, the starting # is usually, 4, 8, 12, 16, 20, 24, 28, 32, 36, etc....  I have used 4 seam 8 plait to make slings before since I was familiar and fast with its use in whipmaking.  That's actually the braid used at the very point of the whip.  Look up leather plaiting and you'll find instructions for 4 seam 8 plait I'm sure.  But all plaiting is best done over a core.  If you use 12 strands of yarn, you can use 4 of those for the core and 8 for the overlay.  But for slings I prefer the Peruvian braids as in Roderick Owen's book.  Google it.  It's rare but available. 

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And David put his hand into his bag and took from it a stone and slung it, and struck the Philistine on his forehead.  And the stone sank into his forehead, so that he fell on his face to the ground.
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paleryder
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Re: Peruvian question
Reply #19 - Feb 12th, 2012 at 12:49am
 
Excellent. Thank you!
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Jaegoor
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Re: Peruvian question
Reply #20 - Feb 12th, 2012 at 4:20am
 
I also have a book of Rodrick Owen. I have found two mistakes in it.
However, it is very good.
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Bono Mellius
 
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Re: Peruvian question
Reply #21 - Feb 12th, 2012 at 9:51am
 
I hope you guys are talking about this 250 Braids book because that is the one I just ordered. Are the mistake easy to identify? What are they? Inquiring minds want to know.
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Re: Peruvian question
Reply #22 - Feb 12th, 2012 at 10:40am
 
http://www.amazon.de/Geflochtene-Kordeln-Tressen-Anleitungsbuch-Mustern/dp/32580...

With two patterns were exchanged count.

However, it is a very good book for Maru Dai twist.
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Re: Peruvian question
Reply #23 - Feb 13th, 2012 at 5:24pm
 
Does anyone else find that having a core impacts accuracy? It might be my loose weaving, but I find that the sling tends to twist weirdly around the core sometimes while throwing...the latest models (no fancy 16 color braids mind you) I've just 4 strand round braided to the pouch, tying off my strands before I start weaving (much easier to do walking I think Cheesy).
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Re: Peruvian question
Reply #24 - Feb 13th, 2012 at 5:51pm
 
Did you braid around a loose core(core that wasn't tied to anything when braiding) ?
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Re: Peruvian question
Reply #25 - Feb 13th, 2012 at 8:14pm
 
I have tapered a mantle over core by cutting a braided strand and replacing it in the braid with a strand from the core. That way the cut strands are pinched into the braid, and not loose in the core. I guess I don't know if it's really desireable or not, but I was thinking the core would keep the cords from stretching, and that loose strands in the core would not provide that function. My thinking might be off, but that's what I thought. The sling I made for jlasud at Christmas was done that way, although it was eight around two in the retention, two fives through the split pouch, rejoined as a four-strand (four pairs) since I was advised not to try to taper an eight or twelve-strand braid, then I dropped (cut) two of the eight and replaced them in the braid with the core strands when I started to taper the release. Everything locked in. Once again, not something I swear by, just something that occured to me to do. Hope your peruvian comes out cool. I bet it will, and you'll have a great experience working with it for sure.
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Re: Peruvian question
Reply #26 - Feb 13th, 2012 at 8:58pm
 
Do you have a picture of your sling? Love to see it.
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Well, I did it.
Reply #27 - Feb 14th, 2012 at 1:50am
 
I purchased Cahlander's book "Sling Braiding of the Andes". The other book (Owen's) is on its way. For the most part, Cahlander's book has been easy to follow but I haven't gotten too far. Got far enough to try the 16 strand upbraid with no core.

Here's my first attempt with a mini-sling:

http://i1039.photobucket.com/albums/a480/paleryder1/Slings/P2140199.jpg

http://i1039.photobucket.com/albums/a480/paleryder1/Slings/P2140198.jpg

Sorry about the poor quality of the photos. I'm about as good at taking pictures as I am at making slings.

I was amazed- it worked! I'm still uncertain as to how much tension to try and achieve. I pulled down each layer tightly then snugged up the layer I was getting ready to braid. It seemed to keep things tight. There's a little play. This is 80/20 (acrylic/wool), bulky weight, if that makes a difference.

I can do the finger loop and start the cord. I think I can probably do the pouch. What I'm uncertain about is how to add in additional strands. In Cahlander's book, she describes a guy doing a 16 braid strand and then before getting to the cradle, he adds another 16 strands (for total of 32), which he braids for several inches before he begins the cradle. How is this done?

I have 4/4/4/4 strands.  I was thinking about lying four long strands in a + over the existing strands and then try to figure out how to continue the braid. Not sure that would work because the new strands would just fold over on themselves, right?  I then thought about hitching a new strand to each of the 16 but the transitions on the slings in her book are pretty clean. Not sure what will work.

Any ideas? Thanks for your encouragement!

May it be blessed,
Todd
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jlasud
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Re: Peruvian question
Reply #28 - Feb 14th, 2012 at 8:45am
 
Here's the sling i got from Matt, it has no stretch on the retention cord and a tiny bit of stretch on release cord:
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Re: Peruvian question
Reply #29 - Feb 14th, 2012 at 2:58pm
 
Cahlander's book is also great and Tada's book is in Japanese and harder to follow but has the most complex stuff in it.  250 braids is the best all around.

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And David put his hand into his bag and took from it a stone and slung it, and struck the Philistine on his forehead.  And the stone sank into his forehead, so that he fell on his face to the ground.
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