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gun carry (Read 1355 times)
Mauro Fiorentini
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gun carry
Nov 12th, 2011 at 1:45pm
 
The concept that somebody, don't matter who, can bring a weapon anywhere without being spotted does not seem nice to me.
I think that civilized people does not need guns at all.
Greetings,
Mauro.

okay, so i wanted to figure out how this forum settings worked, and i thought this sorta went off topic so i'm splitting it andm oving it other topics- xxkid123
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« Last Edit: Nov 12th, 2011 at 7:57pm by xxkid123 »  

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timann
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Re: How, Where, and How Often do you carry a Sling
Reply #1 - Nov 12th, 2011 at 4:15pm
 
I always carry at least one, but usually two lenghts of paracord in my pockets that  can be made into slings in minutes.
I also got a sling (and a tennis ball - dog toy, you know) in the backpack I frequently carry.  And one, also usually with a tennis ball, among my running gear, as I tend to do a bit of morning slinging.
Except from this I barely ever carry any slings around unless there is a chance I`m going to use one.
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Jabames
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Re: How, Where, and How Often do you carry a Sling
Reply #2 - Nov 12th, 2011 at 4:17pm
 
If you don't like it,  then whatever floats your boat,  us Americans are proud of it  Smiley
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Mauro Fiorentini
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Re: How, Where, and How Often do you carry a Sling
Reply #3 - Nov 12th, 2011 at 6:34pm
 
Oh I know, and it's fine for me, for I'm not yet thinking of coming in the U.S.  Grin

However, since we've roused the discussion, may I ask what do you think about life in other Countries where guns are banished?
I mean, do you think we miss them?
We should be allowed to carry them?
How do you see us (if you do have interest in this, obviously)?
Greetings,
Mauro.
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Jabames
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Re: How, Where, and How Often do you carry a Sling
Reply #4 - Nov 12th, 2011 at 6:41pm
 
well if the government doesnt like it,  and the people arent used to having owned weapons then no,  but they should still be able to carry knives,  at least they would have somethin to cut with besides scissors  Smiley.  I mean who would ban man's most important and oldest tool,  using it as a weapon would be on my extreme last resort.
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Mauro Fiorentini
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Re: How, Where, and How Often do you carry a Sling
Reply #5 - Nov 12th, 2011 at 6:50pm
 
That's interesting - my job often requires the swift aid of a knife, so we actually bring them.
But I leave it at the shipyard when I've to come home - I once have seen a stab wound and all that blood impressed me.
Not that I'd be able to stab anyone, but thinking that the person I'm arguing with can have a knife too, makes me nervous.
By the way, it's also true that if somebody has in mind to kill you, any weapon would fit him: some time ago a car driver killed 2 people using his portable car lifter.
I'm not really against guns, I just don't like the idea - still, no: I prefer the idea that guns are not necessary in a civil debate - and, if it comes to hands, it's better to exchange a couple of punches that a stab  Smiley
Greetings,
Mauro.
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Re: How, Where, and How Often do you carry a Sling
Reply #6 - Nov 12th, 2011 at 6:53pm
 
Although I have many guns,  I'm leaning more towards primitive stuff,  for example the sling of course.
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Mauro Fiorentini
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Re: How, Where, and How Often do you carry a Sling
Reply #7 - Nov 12th, 2011 at 6:57pm
 
Yes, I'm attracted by primitive guns, too - to tell the truth, my cellar looks like a Medieval armory  Cheesy
I sometime wonder how would Police react if they saw me walking around in lamellar vest, iron helmet, steel broadsword and wooden shield - I think they'd call the asylum  Grin
Maybe I'll begin a "Middle Age-related Fantasy Weaponry" thread one day  Cheesy
Greetings,
Mauro.
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Re: How, Where, and How Often do you carry a Sling
Reply #8 - Nov 12th, 2011 at 6:59pm
 
I'm more of a fan of the Bronze Age,  although not the toughest alloy,  I'm just amazed at the look of bronze.
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Re: How, Where, and How Often do you carry a Sling
Reply #9 - Nov 12th, 2011 at 7:53pm
 
on weapon carry: i'm of the opinion that if people want to carry a gun or knife they should be allowed to do so. however, if to carry a gun they need a special licence with a built in gps so that the police know where that gun always is- so be it. automatics should be banned, and anything over .45 caliber should be banned as well. however, the gun licence should have a low enough filing fee, etc so that everyone has access to it, if they meet background requirements.

i think some of america's gun laws are a little lax, whereas those that do have serious gun control is just too tight.
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Masiakasaurus
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Re: gun carry
Reply #10 - Nov 12th, 2011 at 8:46pm
 
I'd rather outlaw actions than outlaw things. If you have a (legal) reason to use a gun I think you should be able to own it. Since hunting is legal in the US, rifles and shotguns should be legal even though there are also illegal uses of these weapons. Since there are times that it's a good idea to have a gun even though you aren't hunting, I think pistols should also be legal. Defending oneself with a hidden pistol is a gray area. I think conceled carry of a gun is a bad idea, but I know one person who scared off someone trying to rob her at knifepoint by pulling her gun out of it's holster. She probably would have been stabbed if the mugger knew she was reaching for a gun, so I am also grudgingly accepting of concealed carry. While I agree that civilized people do not need guns when dealing with each other, there are times when you have to deal with uncivilized people.
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Mauro Fiorentini
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Re: gun carry
Reply #11 - Nov 12th, 2011 at 8:57pm
 
That's why I learned some kung fu as well as have a past as a boxeur  Smiley

The question is: where all this could lead to? I mean, we (in Italy) never had episodes of violence such as the Columbine School, for example - even if some stupid kids that think acting as the ghetto is cool goes around with hidden knives and batons - and this makes me sick, I've beaten more than one  Angry
Greetings,
Mauro.
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Re: gun carry
Reply #12 - Nov 12th, 2011 at 9:09pm
 
I usually tell people that I carry a gun because I can't carry a policeman. When one has a license to carry a firearm it comes with a certain amount of responsibility. You cannot just pull it out and wave it around. You cannot threaten someone with it. You cannot even shoot someone unless yours or someone elses life is threatened. Step outside of these very stringent boundaries and you will go to jail. Even if you are justified in shooting someone, you have to be able to prove that you tried to withdraw from the altercation. You dont just shoot someone and it is deffinately not like the old West, but there are times when a firearm is needed. In those situations I would rather have one than not have one as my life, or the life of my wife or child might be on the line.
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Masiakasaurus
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Re: gun carry
Reply #13 - Nov 12th, 2011 at 9:18pm
 
Mauro Fiorentini wrote on Nov 12th, 2011 at 8:57pm:
I mean, we (in Italy) never had episodes of violence such as the Columbine School, for example

Comparatively, Italy and Norway have very similar gun laws and Norway has had a Columbine-like shooting fairly recently.
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Norwegian Law: To own a gun in Norway, one must document a use for the gun. By far, the most common grounds for civilian ownership are hunting and sports shooting, in that order. Other needs can include special guard duties or self defence, but the first is rare unless the person shows identification confirming that he or she is a trained guard or member of a law-enforcement agency and the second is practically never accepted as a reason for gun ownership. There are special rules for collectors of guns. They are exempt from many parts of the regulation, but, in turn, they must meet even more narrow qualifications. Collectors may purchase, but not fire without permission, all kinds of guns in their respective areas of interest, which they have defined in advance. Ownership is regulated in paragraph 7, and responsibility for issuing a gun ownership license is given to the police authority in the applicant's district. Rifle and shotgun ownership permission can be given to "sober and responsible" persons 18 years or older. The applicant for the permission must document a need for the weapon. Two exceptions exist to this age qualification. Persons under the age of 18, but over 16 may apply for rifle or shotgun ownership licence with the consent of parents or guardian. For handguns, the lowest ownership age is 21 with no exceptions allowed. For inherited weapons, it is up to the local police chief to make a decision based on the individual facts of the case. An applicant must have a clean police record in order to obtain an ownership license.

Quote:
Italian Law: Italian citizens don't have a constitutional right to keep and bear arms, but different types of licenses can be obtained by the local police authorities. The applicant must be 18 or older, prove he can handle and use a firearm safely, must provide a clean criminal record and must not be mentally ill or be a known abuser of, or addicted to, alcohol or illegal drugs.
Citizens are allowed to own:
  • up to three common firearms (usually handguns, but all firearms not using hunting calibers fall into this category, such as 10-gauge shotguns)
  • up to six weapons that have been specifically engineered and/or manufactured for shooting sports
  • an unlimited number of hunting weapons (both rifles and shotguns)
  • 8 antique or historical weapons (designed, but not produced, before 1891).
Trade and ownership of deactivated and replica firearms is not regulated by law and is unrestricted.

While cases like Columbine high school recieve a lot of media attention, they are actually quite rare.
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Re: gun carry
Reply #14 - Nov 12th, 2011 at 9:41pm
 
America, for good or ill, has a long tradition of individual firearm ownership and strongly associate this with notions going back to the founding of the country.  Citizen-soldiers rising up against tyrant occupiers.   Well, it wasn't that simple and the citizen-soldiers had to be trained and equipped as real soldiers in order to defeat the British... Still, it's very strongly part of American culture.
Add to this our notions of the Wild West, personal freedom, and so forth and you get a pretty strong basis for America's love for weapons.

Besides, it's in the constitution, and the Supreme Court has just this year certified that the 2nd amendment is an "individual right" pertaining to everyone.

Now, as to individual carry of firearms in public...   A sore spot with folks that are appalled by the practice...   I guess I've been reading both sides of this argument since the 60s. 

As Bill Jordan said, "You don't need a gun very often. When you do, you need one real bad."   The vast majority of people who obtain permits to carry weapons will never need them.  Hell, the vast majority of police officers like myself will never need them.  I've been in police work for 40 years and have never been involved in a shooting incident.  I've only drawn my weapon a couple of times, and that only in a "search" or "cover" situation.
However, tomorrow I might have to use it.  Never can tell.
We went through the considerable debate over concealed carry here in Missouri just a few years ago.   The "anti" side predicted shootings in the street, an increase in violence, minor altercations erupting into shootings, etc, etc.
The "pro" side predicted a decrease in crime, as bad guys couldn't tell if a potential victim was packing...

Neither scenario came to be.   There have been essentially no "incidents" in the several years since passage.  Individuals obtaining permits tend to be rather responsible types who must undergo considerable training.  They are unlikely to be hot-tempered types willing to shoot at the drop of a hat.

Likewise, there is little reduction in crime other than the already-falling levels reported by the FBI for the last 20 years or so.   The sorts of people who commit armed robberies on the street are pretty good at picking victims who are unlikely to resist.  These tend to be crimes of opportunity and are seldom well though-out...

Nationally, there are always incidents of armed citizens using firearms to defend themselves.  Just within the last couple of days an older fellow was the victim of a home invasion.  Two armed thugs forced their way in and demanded the guy open his safe.  He did... It contained a handgun and he shot both of them to death. 
Good for him, but these incidents are vastly rare on the national scale.   
Still, I would not wish to tell someone that there is NO chance he might be the victim of such an incident.  Locally, last Summer, a family advertised a diamond ring for sale on Craigslist.  Three individuals showed up to look at it, and one produced a weapon.  The victim's son was killed by the robber, a homicide for a ring valued at under a thousand bucks.
Such things happen.  They happen more frequently in certain areas.   

Most people who go to the trouble to get a carry permit will carry the weapon religiously for a while, then more and more infrequently.  They find out what most police officers already know... Carrying a gun is a pain.  Often, it gets left in the car or even in the wife's purse....
There's a lot of wild rhetoric on both sides of the question.
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