Welcome, Guest. Please Login
SLINGING.ORG
 
Home Help Search Login


Pages: 1 ... 9 10 11 12 
Send Topic Print
Why David chose five stones ,please read ! (Read 51221 times)
Bill Skinner
Forum Moderation
*****
Offline


Slinging Rocks!

Posts: 3292
Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #150 - Nov 18th, 2011 at 2:49pm
 
That's actually a very good point.  Armor was made to fit one specific person, if it didn't fit, you wouldn't be able to see or move freely.  It would bind or flop around, both would hinder free movement.  And Saul was a warrior and had been trained all his life, he would know this.  So, it is possible that David was a lot larger than implied.  The Bible never actually comes out and says that David is small and scrawny, all it says is that David refused Sauls armor because it was too heavy for him.  And if you have not trained in armor, the first times you put it on, it slows you down and messes with your balance.  So it was actually pretty smart to say "thanks but no thanks" because it would have been more of a hindrance.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Aussie
Past Moderator
*
Offline


Joined Nov. 1, 2006  Luke
14:14

Posts: 3265
Melbourne, Australia
Gender: male
Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #151 - Nov 18th, 2011 at 5:00pm
 
I absolutely agree that the notion that David was some little kid doesn't hold up for the very reason you cite. Saul's armour would have had to be at least a close fit or it would never have been tried and Saul was above average in height; it is one of the reasons he was chosen as king. Also, Saul never suggests that Goliath is invicible because of his height but because, "he has been a warrior from his youth". David was the youngest of several brothers but he was likely already in his late teens at the time.
Back to top
 

Cranks are little things that make revolutions.&&
 
IP Logged
 
Dan
Interfector Viris Spurii
SlingingGuide Moderator
*****
Offline


Slinging Rocks!

Posts: 3974
Gender: male
Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #152 - Nov 23rd, 2011 at 9:18am
 
HurlinThom wrote on Nov 18th, 2011 at 4:37am:
I once heard that 40 was a sort of literary device in the Bible used to signify "a lot", as in raining 40 days and nights and wandering in the desert for 40 years.



In the Bible the term 1/3 (like in Rev) ususualy means a lot, usually enough to be catostophic. However I am pretty sure 40 just means 40.
Back to top
 

I was pretty good at slinging like 10 years ago.
 
IP Logged
 
Knaight
Interfector Viris Spurii
*****
Offline


Slinging Tennis Balls!

Posts: 1237
Colorado
Gender: male
Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #153 - Nov 24th, 2011 at 11:03pm
 
Aussie wrote on Nov 18th, 2011 at 5:00pm:
I absolutely agree that the notion that David was some little kid doesn't hold up for the very reason you cite. Saul's armour would have had to be at least a close fit or it would never have been tried and Saul was above average in height; it is one of the reasons he was chosen as king. Also, Saul never suggests that Goliath is invicible because of his height but because, "he has been a warrior from his youth". David was the youngest of several brothers but he was likely already in his late teens at the time.

At the same time, the whole matter of height would be known. That passage was written sometime during the bronze age, and even if it is fictional the author knew that anyone reading could connect the dots that big people are more dangerous in melee combat. Goliath was mighty because of his time as a warrior in addition to that, not instead of that, and given that most anyone who heard the story at the time it was written would know that pointing it out is kind of pointless.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Jabames
Interfector Viris Spurii
*****
Offline


:3

Posts: 1868
Alaska
Gender: male
Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #154 - Nov 29th, 2011 at 5:12am
 
In old Inuit stories (Chukchi but I can call em Inuit  Wink),  the most dangerous and most capable warriors are extremely fit,  not giants,  of course we have stories of giants appearing and challenging whole villages and they are depicted as terrifying.  But top move fast and maneuver better one has to be fit and have plenty of endurance;  soo it was the same in Antiquity(any time for that matter),  the fitter the soldier/warrior the better,  assuming they got a good brain in their skulls to outwit and defeat their enemies  Smiley
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
xxkid123
Past Moderator
*
Offline


Hallo, ich heiße kartoffel

Posts: 4807
new to california
Gender: male
Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #155 - Nov 29th, 2011 at 8:57pm
 
Jabames wrote on Nov 29th, 2011 at 5:12am:
In old Inuit stories (Chukchi but I can call em Inuit  Wink),  the most dangerous and most capable warriors are extremely fit,  not giants,  of course we have stories of giants appearing and challenging whole villages and they are depicted as terrifying.  But top move fast and maneuver better one has to be fit and have plenty of endurance;  soo it was the same in Antiquity(any time for that matter),  the fitter the soldier/warrior the better,  assuming they got a good brain in their skulls to outwit and defeat their enemies  Smiley


i've heard something about in the arctic small was better because you required less resources to function. of course too small and your surface area would be too big and too much heat could be lost.
Back to top
 

There's no break, there's no end, just a-living on;&&Wide awake, with a smile, going on and on.
xxkid123 tanma101  
IP Logged
 
Jabames
Interfector Viris Spurii
*****
Offline


:3

Posts: 1868
Alaska
Gender: male
Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #156 - Nov 29th, 2011 at 9:04pm
 
Yepp, short and broad build of just right physical condition,  I'm nearly 6' though  Cheesy,  normally they would be 5'-5'7" more or less
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Knaight
Interfector Viris Spurii
*****
Offline


Slinging Tennis Balls!

Posts: 1237
Colorado
Gender: male
Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #157 - Dec 6th, 2011 at 8:14am
 
Jabames wrote on Nov 29th, 2011 at 5:12am:
In old Inuit stories (Chukchi but I can call em Inuit  Wink),  the most dangerous and most capable warriors are extremely fit,  not giants,  of course we have stories of giants appearing and challenging whole villages and they are depicted as terrifying.  But top move fast and maneuver better one has to be fit and have plenty of endurance;  soo it was the same in Antiquity(any time for that matter),  the fitter the soldier/warrior the better,  assuming they got a good brain in their skulls to outwit and defeat their enemies  Smiley

Well, fit and trained. Anyone who wins decathlons with some frequency is undeniably fit, but if you take one of them at random, stick a spear in their hand, and put them against a trained spearman who doesn't really do cardio, and doesn't lift weights, and isn't really all that healthy my money is on the guy with the training every time.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
HurlinThom
Interfector Viris Spurii
*****
Offline


Leverage artillerist

Posts: 1458
Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #158 - Dec 6th, 2011 at 10:20am
 
Knaight wrote on Dec 6th, 2011 at 8:14am:
Jabames wrote on Nov 29th, 2011 at 5:12am:
In old Inuit stories (Chukchi but I can call em Inuit  Wink),  the most dangerous and most capable warriors are extremely fit,  not giants,  of course we have stories of giants appearing and challenging whole villages and they are depicted as terrifying.  But top move fast and maneuver better one has to be fit and have plenty of endurance;  soo it was the same in Antiquity(any time for that matter),  the fitter the soldier/warrior the better,  assuming they got a good brain in their skulls to outwit and defeat their enemies  Smiley

Well, fit and trained. Anyone who wins decathlons with some frequency is undeniably fit, but if you take one of them at random, stick a spear in their hand, and put them against a trained spearman who doesn't really do cardio, and doesn't lift weights, and isn't really all that healthy my money is on the guy with the training every time.

I guess you aren't counting javelin throwing as spear training.
Back to top
 

When all is said and done more will have been said than done.
 
IP Logged
 
Knaight
Interfector Viris Spurii
*****
Offline


Slinging Tennis Balls!

Posts: 1237
Colorado
Gender: male
Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #159 - Dec 14th, 2011 at 1:47am
 
HurlinThom wrote on Dec 6th, 2011 at 10:20am:
Knaight wrote on Dec 6th, 2011 at 8:14am:
Jabames wrote on Nov 29th, 2011 at 5:12am:
In old Inuit stories (Chukchi but I can call em Inuit  Wink),  the most dangerous and most capable warriors are extremely fit,  not giants,  of course we have stories of giants appearing and challenging whole villages and they are depicted as terrifying.  But top move fast and maneuver better one has to be fit and have plenty of endurance;  soo it was the same in Antiquity(any time for that matter),  the fitter the soldier/warrior the better,  assuming they got a good brain in their skulls to outwit and defeat their enemies  Smiley

Well, fit and trained. Anyone who wins decathlons with some frequency is undeniably fit, but if you take one of them at random, stick a spear in their hand, and put them against a trained spearman who doesn't really do cardio, and doesn't lift weights, and isn't really all that healthy my money is on the guy with the training every time.

I guess you aren't counting javelin throwing as spear training.

It isn't really applicable for melee combat. That said, if the question is about two people lobbing javelins at each other, the decathlon guy counts as trained. Very trained.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
kentuckythrower
Descens
***
Offline


Illegitimi non carborundum

Posts: 244
Kentucky, U.S.A.
Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #160 - Jan 19th, 2012 at 1:41pm
 
This is an interesting subject. To me, It goes without reason David carried a sling with him at all times, but apparently no ammunition...hence the need to gather pebbles prior to engaging Goliath. Is there a possiblility other slinger's in the army carried no ammunition until just prior to battle and resorted to a quick trip to the local ammunition dump (creek bed) before the battle began? Given the normal description of slingers as being ultra-light troops, this would make sense in that they would travel without the weight of a pouch full of ammunition, then only load up for battle just prior to going into action.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Masiakasaurus
Forum Moderation
*****
Offline


mah-SEE-a-kah-SOR-us

Posts: 6069
Alabama, USA
Gender: male
Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #161 - Jan 19th, 2012 at 6:49pm
 
I imagine that dedicated slingers carried their own ammo, and that other types of troops which only had slings as a secondary/tertiary weapon would forgo carrying stones with them.
Back to top
 

Pikåru wrote on Nov 19th, 2013 at 6:59pm:
Massi - WTF? It's called a sling. You use it to throw rocks farther and faster than you could otherwise. That's all. 
~Engineers like to solve problems. If there are no problems handily avialable, they will create their own problems.~
WWW elsabio04  
IP Logged
 
paleryder
Descens
***
Offline



Posts: 110
Le Roy, IL
Gender: male
Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #162 - Feb 8th, 2012 at 9:37pm
 
I was always taught that the Bible stories were multi-dimensional. There's the physical world event, a moral element and a spiritual element. The five stones could easily have been just that- five stones. Why five? Many have already opined on this but there is no obvious reason to mention this if we are looking for a materialistic meaning.

To understand this story, andt he five stones, you need to look to the spiritual element. The story is about the battle between good and evil. This doesn't discount the historical event but the purpose of the event and story is much larger. While the Bible contains history, it wasn't written as a history book. So, Hebrews represented the good and the Philistines the bad. David, the champion, did what that the others did not do? he realied on God. He didn't rely on physical armor. He wasn't scared. He demonstrated faith as his shield and believed that the hand of God would guide his sling to strike down the poster child of evil- Goliath. David was laughed at because he was a boy and not a trained and proven warrior. The laughed because they were afraid.

So, the five stones represented the basis of the Hebrew faith in God- the Torah, the five Books of Moses. This is as plausible understanding once you read the text for spiritual meaning. Without this meaning, there is no need to comment on the fact that there were five stones. The only signficance of five that I have been able to find in the Jewish Tanach is the five books of Moses. The idea that the stones foreshadow the deaths of Goliath's brothers is a stretch, despite what Grant Jeffries says. They simply represented God's Law, the foundation of the Hebrew faith in the battle against evil.

My .02.

May it be blessed,
Todd
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
timothy42b
Junior Member
**
Offline



Posts: 65
Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #163 - Feb 9th, 2012 at 12:38pm
 
On the choice of five:

A soldier going into battle wants all the ammo he can carry plus a little more. 

A warrior about to fight a one-on-one duel has very different needs.  The more ammo he carries the less mobility he has, but also the less ability to recover from a miss.  It is not impossible that five stones is the max one can carry and still move quickly over rough terrain while fighting a duel.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
kentuckythrower
Descens
***
Offline


Illegitimi non carborundum

Posts: 244
Kentucky, U.S.A.
Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #164 - Feb 9th, 2012 at 1:11pm
 
I think the reason he selected five stones is related to his personal probablility of a "hit-kill" ratio. I figure he knew it was around 20% and experience told him five stone would get the job done. I personally think he was an adept slinger, but a far cry form anything similar to what could be considered an expert.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Pages: 1 ... 9 10 11 12 
Send Topic Print
(Moderators: David Morningstar, Mauro Fiorentini, Bill Skinner, Chris, Curious Aardvark, Masiakasaurus, Rat Man)