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Why David chose five stones ,please read ! (Read 21460 times)
Dr.Q
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Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #15 - Nov 7th, 2010 at 4:25am
 
I have read the Bible like you, and I go for the other four giants and the case that they could come to the battle in the Ela valley. This giants were the sons of Orpah. David knew them well because Orpah was his grandmother's(Ruth) sister in law. They were not blood family but they were realted somewhat. Goliath was the oldest of the giants and thus much older than David.
The Bible has sybolisms throught the pages, but David history with Goliath was battle itself and the amount of stones didn't bring any symbols to be decoded. David didn't get five stones in case he missed one because he had practiced slingling all his life and conquered beasts since a young age. He brought the five stones in case the other giants reached the Ela valley. Anyway they did not go there that day but they were killed later.
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Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #16 - Nov 7th, 2010 at 10:50am
 
It's a fun story, anyway.
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Dan
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Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #17 - Nov 8th, 2010 at 8:01am
 
Dr.Q wrote on Nov 7th, 2010 at 4:25am:
I have read the Bible like you, and I go for the other four giants and the case that they could come to the battle in the Ela valley. This giants were the sons of Orpah. David knew them well because Orpah was his grandmother's(Ruth) sister in law. They were not blood family but they were realted somewhat. Goliath was the oldest of the giants and thus much older than David.
The Bible has sybolisms throught the pages, but David history with Goliath was battle itself and the amount of stones didn't bring any symbols to be decoded. David didn't get five stones in case he missed one because he had practiced slingling all his life and conquered beasts since a young age. He brought the five stones in case the other giants reached the Ela valley. Anyway they did not go there that day but they were killed later.


Thank you
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"Like tying a stone to a sling is the giving of honor to a fool" Proverbs 26:8

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Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #18 - Jan 9th, 2011 at 2:39pm
 
I tend to believe that although David trusted God, and with good reason, he knew that God seldom grants us victories over problems and trouble in our life instantly.  Therefore he couldn't be sure that Goliath would go down with only one stone.  He trusted God, but was prepared to cooperate with God in being prepared and in doing all he could with his own strength and skills while trusting that God would see him through in the end.  In this instance, I believe God intended to reward Davids public trust in him with an instant and public example.  Despite Davids probable considerable skills, the implication of the story was that the ultimate credit went to God for Davids success.  Incidently, the archaological record indicates that the cubit in use in Israel up till the time of Hezekiah was the royal Egyptian cubit that the Hebrews brought with them out of Egypt and it was standardized throughout Egypt at 20.6".  So at the time the story of David and Goliath was written, the cubit in use would have made Goliath close to 11 feet tall.  I suspect he was a genetic throwback to pre-flood times.  Just as the fossil record demonstrates the unusual size of plant and animal life before the flood, I believe humans preflood where of unusual size.  The bible hints at this by showing the rapid deterioration of life expectancy immediatly after the flood and by a cryptic reference to people being giants in the land.  Paleantologists have found human bones that had to come from people at least 12 feet tall.(I am not refering to the recent photos circulated on the web that were obvious hoaxes.)  Fossilized footprints have been found in the mud next to dinosaur footprints( in one case superimposed in a dinosaur footprint) around 15" long.  For those that disagree I respect that.  But there is a good reason why most archaologists ignore giant human bones and footprints.  Because it doesn't fit with what they want to believe.
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Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #19 - Jan 17th, 2011 at 11:15am
 
Quote:
Personally I think it was more like a "trust in god, but let´s carry this extra ammo just in case" kinda thing.

I think so too.  Love the way you said it. Cheesy
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Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #20 - Jan 17th, 2011 at 12:59pm
 
starhiker wrote on Jan 9th, 2011 at 2:39pm:
I tend to believe that although David trusted God, and with good reason, he knew that God seldom grants us victories over problems and trouble in our life instantly.  Therefore he couldn't be sure that Goliath would go down with only one stone.  He trusted God, but was prepared to cooperate with God in being prepared and in doing all he could with his own strength and skills while trusting that God would see him through in the end.  In this instance, I believe God intended to reward Davids public trust in him with an instant and public example.  Despite Davids probable considerable skills, the implication of the story was that the ultimate credit went to God for Davids success.  Incidently, the archaological record indicates that the cubit in use in Israel up till the time of Hezekiah was the royal Egyptian cubit that the Hebrews brought with them out of Egypt and it was standardized throughout Egypt at 20.6".  So at the time the story of David and Goliath was written, the cubit in use would have made Goliath close to 11 feet tall.  I suspect he was a genetic throwback to pre-flood times.  Just as the fossil record demonstrates the unusual size of plant and animal life before the flood, I believe humans preflood where of unusual size.  The bible hints at this by showing the rapid deterioration of life expectancy immediatly after the flood and by a cryptic reference to people being giants in the land.  Paleantologists have found human bones that had to come from people at least 12 feet tall.(I am not refering to the recent photos circulated on the web that were obvious hoaxes.)  Fossilized footprints have been found in the mud next to dinosaur footprints( in one case superimposed in a dinosaur footprint) around 15" long.  For those that disagree I respect that.  But there is a good reason why most archaologists ignore giant human bones and footprints.  Because it doesn't fit with what they want to believe.


Thanks for tuning in starhiker it is good to find other bible believing people on here , welcome.
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"Like tying a stone to a sling is the giving of honor to a fool" Proverbs 26:8

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Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #21 - May 11th, 2011 at 6:47pm
 
starhiker wrote on Jan 9th, 2011 at 2:39pm:
Fossilized footprints have been found in the mud next to dinosaur footprints( in one case superimposed in a dinosaur footprint) around 15" long.  For those that disagree I respect that.  But there is a good reason why most archaologists ignore giant human bones and footprints.  Because it doesn't fit with what they want to believe.


Wait, wait, wait. I've got no problem with pre-flood giants, but are you suggesting that people were wandering around at the same time as the dinosuars?



I'd also like to apologize for necro'ing this thread.  And the other one I did earlier.
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Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #22 - May 12th, 2011 at 2:36am
 
Indeed. I'd like to see some references for these claims too. It's not enough to say they are in the Bible and we should all accept that. I'd like to see the Biblical reference matched with a modern scientific/archaeological one.

Anyone care to set me right?


Mods, is this is too touchy a subject?


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Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #23 - May 12th, 2011 at 3:34am
 
snowcelt wrote on May 12th, 2011 at 2:36am:
Indeed. I'd like to see some references for these claims too. It's not enough to say they are in the Bible and we should all accept that. I'd like to see the Biblical reference matched with a modern scientific/archaeological one.

Anyone care to set me right?


Mods, is this is too touchy a subject?




No, it's not too touchy, provided people are willing to accept that it is very speculative. The Bible itself is very light on detail; no descrition of the throw, nor of the distance, is given. Goliath's height is stated as being six cubits and a span but some ancient texts say only four cubits and a span. Ignoring or overlooking evidence which doesn't fit into the prevailing viewpoint is a trap we all can fall into.

Similarly, any speculation that the five stones represent Goliath's five brothers is just that, speculation. There is NO definite Biblical reference to confirm that. As is the notion that Goliath was really struck on the kneecap. This idea is based on tha similarity of the words for forehead and kneecap. It is surmised that Goliath's forehead would have been covered by his helmet and he would not have fallen forward if struck on the forehead. Perhaps he was wearing a short helmet and tripped?

We have to accept that we can never really know some of these finer details.
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Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #24 - May 12th, 2011 at 4:33am
 
Well, um, what claims are we talking about ?

--the story of David and Goliath ? (in the Bible)

--humans and dinosaurs at the same time (not in the Bible, really)

or should we just sling ?
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snowcelt
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Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #25 - May 12th, 2011 at 5:03am
 
Let's just go slinging. Best idea I've heard all day!  Grin
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Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #26 - May 12th, 2011 at 10:58am
 
Not to get into anything but one aspect of the discussion, even a forehead hit would have reuslted in Goliath falling forward. A slingstone simply lacks the momentum to topple someone backward. In fact, that much momentum delivered to the head would have broken Goliath's neck. Killed or merely stunned, his knees would have buckled and he would have fallen forward.

Similarly, if you shoot a deer with a rifle bullet having 2500 foot pounds of energy the deer drops; it doesn't go flying 100 yards.

This is basic physics, conservation of momentum versus conservation of energy.
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Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #27 - May 12th, 2011 at 6:46pm
 
the trauma force is the same at the point of impact as it is when the weapon recoils= when you get hit by a projectile, the backward force is the exact same as the recoil from the weapon. considering a slings "recoil" (how much force is put on you if you get hit by the release cord) is not much, you would fall forward if hit in the forehead with a  sling stone
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Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #28 - May 12th, 2011 at 8:26pm
 
Aussie wrote on May 12th, 2011 at 3:34am:
No, it's not too touchy, provided people are willing to accept that it is very speculative. The Bible itself is very light on detail; no descrition of the throw, nor of the distance, is given. Goliath's height is stated as being six cubits and a span but some ancient texts say only four cubits and a span. Ignoring or overlooking evidence which doesn't fit into the prevailing viewpoint is a trap we all can fall into.

It is also worth noting that what exactly a cubit is is unknown. We can state that it originated from a body based measurement, but estimates from 1.5 to 4 feet are common. 1.5 is the most reasonable of these, which gives Goliath at least 6 feet of height -given the low meat diet and agricultural lifestyle in the region at that time, over 6 feet would be a giant, particularly if the person were also well muscled and broad shouldered-something expected in a champion.
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Re: Why David chose five stones ,please read !
Reply #29 - May 16th, 2011 at 6:57pm
 
I believe the commonly accepted measurement for a cubit is from the elbow to the tips of the fingers.
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