I think it's a rear view of a right handed slinger leaning back before the actual slinging motion in a similar way to the Nick LLoyd style mentioned above. Sure the head is turned a long way to the left and probably too much of the face is visible but it's not my intention to criticize the artistic merit. I think the detail that shows the thumb free and not gripping the release cord is quite likely accurate in that it is not impossible to sling that way.

I admit I am well out of my depth from the knowledge of history point of view but as an interested amatuer I suggest that duelling battles between bodies of slingers at ranges of over 100m would be largely ineffective. Even with a rifle and only iron sights it is hard to hit a man who is moving about at that range. With a sling stone the flight time to a target so distant would be at least 2-3 seconds. It would be impossible to predict where a person hopping about from side to side would actually be when the projectile arrived, even in the unlikely event you were accurate enough to group your shots so well as to hit a man sized target.

I assume you mean that the Greek style starting position necessitates a rotation above the head in the horizontal plane. DM above demonstrates a style which he and I call simple overhead (avoiding complications with the Greek style label) Starting in the notional Greek position which allows rudimentary aiming along the cords, allow the pouch to drop behind the back whilst the right hand performs the last half of a normal Fig.8 cast. Turning slightly on the ball of the left foot allows the sling to pass directly overhead greatly reducing lateral dispersion of shots.

I imagine soldiers have always inscribed their projectiles with insulting messages. I remember seeing a brief propaganda clip showing Polish soldiers now serving alongside Soviet forces with a light artillery shell having "Za Katyn" on it written in chalk. The shell was symbolically pointed westwards towards the Germans. Should have been pointing the other way; bitter, bitter irony that one.

From 'The Greek State at War, Part V'

Quote:

One of the many sources showing that Greeks and Romans believed that the sling bullet went so fast it got hot (perhaps more likely to have been due to transfer to kinetic energy ?). Nice catch, any way, re disposition of psiloi.

Thearos wrote on May 7^th, 2009 at 10:49am:


Been quite intrigued by how often this notion of lead glandes melting comes up. It's almost certainly nonsense but I Googled the specific heat and melting point of lead to do some ball park calculations.

Apparently lead has a very low specific heat, ie it takes only a small amount of energy to heat it up. (Actual figures are, 0.16 J/g.degreeC for lead, whereas for water it is 4.2 J/g.degreeC) The melting point of lead is 327 C.

A 50 gram projectile moving at 60 m/s has 90 J of kinetic energy, so if all this was converted to heat it would raise the temperature of the lead by 11.2 degrees. (Note major correction if you read the original post where I forgot to divide by the mass.)

Of course the actual amount of KE converted to heat by friction with the air would be very small, perhaps 10 - 20%, and the air itself would absorb some of the energy, like blowing on something to cool it. However an impact with with a hard unyielding surface (like a shield) would cause a sudden rise in the glandes temperature as the remaining KE was dissipated and such a gland would more likely be recovered quickly.  So, perhaps the lead gland would be perceptibly hotter after being thrown hard, at least for a short time.

This is also one of the main sources (along with a few references in the medical writers) to lead sling bullets penetrating flesh--one of the reasons T. Rihll believes lead bullets to have been fired by catapults, if need be small and hand held: she thinks a slinger can't throw fast enough to make a bullet go through skin. But the topic's been broached already (I wondered if anyone had slung against a pig carcass or ballistic jelly).

Rihll also notices that the description of the wound, with raised swelling, looks very similar to descriptions of gunshot trauma...

There is an article on this, which I haven't read:

F. P. Moog, ‘Zur Traumatologie der antiken Schleuderbleie’, Medizin historisches Journal 37 (2002) 123-37.

Thearos wrote on May 7^th, 2009 at 9:50pm:


Sorry have not read anything by T Rihll so I have no personal opinion. However as you know, others on this forum believe her to greatly underestimate the speed of slung projectiles. I think that unfabricatable reports of penetrative wounds by lead sling glandes are more than likely accurate especially as these can be quite pointy which greatly aids penetration.

Two questions:

do hand slung things go at that speed ?

WHy does pointiness not matter ? Sorry-- I would have thought that a pointed projectile would go faster (and hence have better change of penetration) and that the shape would help a little ?