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Re: david and goliath (Read 100008 times)
timann
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Re: david and goliath
Reply #90 - Jan 29th, 2009 at 1:50pm
 
Congratulations, Luis. As expected you did your part wery well.
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Re: david and goliath
Reply #91 - Jan 29th, 2009 at 3:10pm
 
Great job! Keep up the slinging!

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Re: david and goliath
Reply #92 - Jan 29th, 2009 at 7:40pm
 
Fantastic slinging!
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Re: david and goliath
Reply #93 - Jan 31st, 2009 at 1:13pm
 
Great shot, Louis! Would be great to see such skill in reality.

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Re: david and goliath
Reply #94 - Feb 1st, 2009 at 5:56pm
 
It is wonderful to see such accuracy, both at the impact sensor and the coke bottles.  I shall try and copy your grip and put the finger loop on the second instead of the first finger.  Thank you very much for sharing your knowledge and skill.
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Slings: bestowing the gift of flight on paralyised rocks from the textile age and before. It only takes a moment to help, please give your time generously.
 
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Re: david and goliath
Reply #95 - Feb 2nd, 2009 at 6:28am
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELYea2UDfeY&feature=channel_page
Video of luis pons livermore recreating goliaths downfall.

Given that this is the project goliath section and this is the first proper scientific testing of the theory, I figure this deserves to be stickied.

Even given that luis would be more suited to playing goliath Wink it's still a pretty good bit of video.
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Re: david and goliath
Reply #96 - Feb 2nd, 2009 at 9:13am
 
Thanks for posting the link. Thanks especially to Luis for offering his services as it gives a lot of credibility to the segment to see a genuine slinger demonstrate his skill.

Strange how they were looking for a striking force rather than an energy or even momentum figure. Most ballistics tables for firearms stress energy as "striking force" is very dependent on the nature of the object being struck. For example cricketers or baseballers will easily absorb the impact of a catch as their hands move back even an inch or so. The same ball if striking their heads would cause serious injury or death. The collision takes place over a shorter time so the force is inversely greater,  a phenomenon known as the impulse of the force.

Pity they didn't chronograph and weigh the stone. It would have been nice to know how fast and how heavy it was to compare with my/our own capabilities. They comment on the fact that the tail of the release cord "beaks the sound barrier" which actually has no bearing on the speed of the stone which has well and truly exited the pouch by that time anyway.

Still much more objective than the run of the mill DvG type presentations where they can't quite decide if they think the encounter was a "miracle" or not and lob for a sort of non-miraculous miracle stance.
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Re: david and goliath
Reply #97 - Feb 2nd, 2009 at 12:15pm
 
Aussie wrote on Feb 2nd, 2009 at 9:13am:
Thanks for posting the link. Thanks especially to Luis for offering his services as it gives a lot of credibility to the segment to see a genuine slinger demonstrate his skill.

Strange how they were looking for a striking force rather than an energy or even momentum figure. Most ballistics tables for firearms stress energy as "striking force" is very dependent on the nature of the object being struck. For example cricketers or baseballers will easily absorb the impact of a catch as their hands move back even an inch or so. The same ball if striking their heads would cause serious injury or death. The collision takes place over a shorter time so the force is inversely greater,  a phenomenon known as the impulse of the force.

Pity they didn't chronograph and weigh the stone. It would have been nice to know how fast and how heavy it was to compare with my/our own capabilities. They comment on the fact that the tail of the release cord "beaks the sound barrier" which actually has no bearing on the speed of the stone which has well and truly exited the pouch by that time anyway.

Still much more objective than the run of the mill DvG type presentations where they can't quite decide if they think the encounter was a "miracle" or not and lob for a sort of non-miraculous miracle stance.

I agree with a lot of your reservations, Aussie, but on the positive side - this is the first example as far as I know where a program researcher actually contacted this Forum to actually seek advice, and I think we might take it that the responses had a positive effect.

There were certainly some tiresome aspects of the program, and like you I would take some exception to some of the 'physics' arguments (not withstanding the appearance of various academics!) but I suppose I'm resigned nowadays to the production values of such programs being more tightly controlled by 'entertainment' rather than solid closely argued discussion, which has low market appeal nowadays.

The makers of these programs are (unfortunately!) not making them for those few of us who eagerly await every detail to be gleaned. I think the constraints often mean that the contributions of experts are not really done justice either.

This program at least did an outstanding job of showing a modern expert slinger doing something tremendously impressive. I think that is something to treasure!
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Re: david and goliath
Reply #98 - Feb 2nd, 2009 at 12:21pm
 

Luis tried to have my media (vhs) converted at local shops, but it was not working.
I’m glad he finally got something to see from some source.

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Re: david and goliath
Reply #99 - Feb 2nd, 2009 at 3:53pm
 
Hey tom, I couldn't get nothing from your tape, but thanks a lot for sending it, I had lot of luck, because i could downloaded from internet just loking in some pages, and there it was, in a torrent program i think, I just put the name of the pogram and in couple of hours I had it.
Thank you for sending the packet that fast, in one week it was in my home.

wen I have time I will answer to all the other questions you made me.
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Re: david and goliath
Reply #100 - Feb 2nd, 2009 at 5:07pm
 
wanderer wrote on Feb 2nd, 2009 at 12:15pm:
The makers of these programs are (unfortunately!) not making them for those few of us who eagerly await every detail to be gleaned. I think the constraints often mean that the contributions of experts are not really done justice either.

This program at least did an outstanding job of showing a modern expert slinger doing something tremendously impressive. I think that is something to treasure!


Sorry if I came across as overly negative, but I think they wasted Luis's talents a bit by having him sling at a load cell. A lifesize statue of Goliath with a closeup slo-mo of the stone striking him on the forehead would have been visually much more effective as well. Even a plywood cutout of a Goliath size figure the way that Techstuf did, would be good. (BTW. Both Techstuf's videos are still active on YouTube and there's something so convincing about seeing that fist sized rock imbedded in Goliath's chin.)

Also, "3.62 kN force", has no meaning to most people, whereas, "a 5 oz. stone travelling at 130 mph with the same energy as a .38" cal. S&W", or whatever the figures worked out to, is something people understand. (Especially in the US where most people own one or two Grin)
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Re: david and goliath
Reply #101 - Feb 11th, 2009 at 5:56am
 
hello the sling is vegetable fiber , and in the last test, the one with the mesure impact piece, It take me 4 or 5 stones until I got it. Its a shame that the only part ot testing was that, because first we had to shmash a bottle, then long distnace test, that were very nice images, and they put the impact test. But its  really a nice documentary.

PD: the only slinging federation with a reglament and status is in Balearic islands, nobody wants to make an other in some part of the wolrd? so we can make competicions against other people arround the wolrd.
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Re: david and goliath
Reply #102 - Feb 11th, 2009 at 10:47am
 
Quote:
nobody wants to make an other in some part of the wolrd? so we can make competicions against other people arround the wolrd.


I'm trying mate I really am.
But alas one man can only do so much.

I'll be running another uk slingfest this year - and it's start.
But you guys have many hundreds of years of practice, tradition and experience behind you - I've got a lot of catching up to do before Smiley

Now if the balearic federaton were to issue an invite to uk slingers I'm sure I could put together at least 4 of us to come over and play with you Smiley
I figure david morningstar and I for definites and maybe a couple of the others as well.

It's a thought anyway.

But we're a long way from any kind of organisation I'm afraid to say.
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Do All things with Honour and Generosity: Regret Nothing, Envy None, Apologise Seldom and Bow your head to No One  - works for me Smiley
 
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Re: david and goliath
Reply #103 - Sep 16th, 2009 at 7:26am
 
I am also working on getting people together for competition, traveling to spain is far off still though.
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On the Swedish coast   With Russia in the distance Slinging at the bear. (4accord done it) "Mind must be firmer, heart the more fierce, courage the greater, as our strength diminishes."  The old warrior Byrhtwold during the battle of Maldon in 991 AD.
 
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Re: david and goliath
Reply #104 - Feb 15th, 2010 at 7:10pm
 
In response to Iron Goober in the Overlooked variable thread, taking the Bible literally must be done very carefully. Remember that you are reading an update of a translation of a translation of a translation (check my math: Original Aramaic to Greek to Latin to German/English and then modernized. 1 original, 3 translations, and a revision). I am Christian, though several on this forum are not, and I do not believe that anyone could translate through 3 languages with readers over 1685 years and orally passing on these stories for as much as 6000+ years before that without the meaning of the words let alone the way people think changing. If you are going to take the Word literally use the direct dead sea scrolls translation to avoid language drift, and try and think like someone living through these events. Otherwise your cultural biases will inevitably color your judgment without you realizing it.

And for the thread topic itself, the overlooked variables: David was probably a 5 ft. 15 year old (or older, "manhood" was historically at age 25) with no armor and a weapon that in all likelihood was not scorned by his own warriors nor the opposing side. So why is there the popular myth of the 12 year old being laughed at who surprised everyone by defeating the 12 ft. monster? Why? And what about Elhanan son of Jair? in 2 Samuel 21:19 he is credited with killing Goliath! (Except in KJV where they added 'brother of' so that Elhanan killed Goliath's brother.) I don't mean for anyone to point and shout "ahah! proof of the fallacy!" but these are the things I wonder about. Regardless of religion someone killed Goliath.
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Pikåru wrote on Nov 19th, 2013 at 6:59pm:
Massi - WTF? It's called a sling. You use it to throw rocks farther and faster than you could otherwise. That's all. 
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