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Where are the powerful shots? (Read 7429 times)
looter
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Where are the powerful shots?
May 3rd, 2007 at 1:11am
 
Okay I'm only a beginner right now so I understand that it won't be til quite some time of practicing that I'll start achieving some powerful shots.


I saw a video on the main page by Barak and I immediately thought that his technique was pretty cool and that with the whipping sound that sling made as the rock flew, it must have been a pretty powerful shot.


But I've come across some videos here and there where experienced slingers achieve these wussy shots. Now I'm just wondering, why is that? I see these videos where people only rotate once gently before they release and that worries me. Am I doing my slinging the wrong way when make several rotations? Where are these 250 mph shots like it says on the main page that are possible? I just saw a video of some guy launching a gentle shot at a wooden Goliath and the rock didn't even go through. Was that guy who came out on Digging for the Truth in the episode that was about King Tut right when he was shocked when he found out that King Tut had a sling and continued to call it a humble weapon used by shepherds to scare off animals (he immediately began to talk about how the bow was a real weapon, unlike the sling)?
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Tint
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Re: Where are the powerful shots?
Reply #1 - May 3rd, 2007 at 4:55am
 
There are many different styles to throw with the sling.  Some are more powerful than others.  Some trade off power with a faster draw.

Here is a video of me slinging tennis balls with different styles:

http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1156823087/0#0

I dare not say that I am a powerful shot.  My best range is about 300m.

Yurek is one of the best slingers on the forum you might want to check out his videos too.

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sv
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Re: Where are the powerful shots?
Reply #2 - May 3rd, 2007 at 7:17am
 
don't worry about power -
even a wussy shot is far harder than a stone thrown by hand.
all you will do is hurt your shoulder and elbow muscles is you try for distance straight off, but the muscles will develop themselves and range will increase with moderate practice.

accuracy IS power

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Curious Aardvark
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Re: Where are the powerful shots?
Reply #3 - May 3rd, 2007 at 7:27am
 
Different styles are used for different purposes.

Generally we have to trade off power for accuracy. And if the video you saw was of techstuff slinging through thick plywood and didn't strike you as powerful, then I'm surprised and you obviously don't know what you're seeing. Plywood is incredibly tough stuff due to the alternating grain of the veneers, it's like laminated armour.
[url]http://members.aol.com/curiousaardvark/goliath.wmv[/url]
The throw may not look powerful that's because it's very good technique, very little wasted effort. But those rocks doing that kind of damage to thick plywood - that takes power and a helluva lot of practice to even hit the bloody thing :-)
'wussy' lol The chin shot is a killing blow, no question, it would have either knocked him out directly or gone straight through the throat - either way the guys dead as a doornail.  The chest shot would crack ribs and probably cause internal bleeding at the least. And even if you slow the video down and check it frame by frame the rock travels too fast for you to spot between the sling and the target.

Windups are something of an optional exercise, I personally don't use a wind up of any kind on a regular basis. I find that short slings do not benefit from them. Realistically only longer slings and heavier projectiles would benefit from numerous windups. Plus it looks silly (lol) ;-)

And most of my throws are fairly powerful, unless I'm aiming to drop a stone somewhere specific.
Technique, practice and more practice are far more likely to get you decent power than just swinging it round your head  a few times :-)
Think efficient transfer of effort. And then watch a major league baseball pitcher and try and workout how such an un hurried movement that doesn't look like they're straining can generate that kind of speed in such a heavy object. Technique and practice.

And when you get tired of that - just practice your technique a bit more :-)
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pancaker
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Re: Where are the powerful shots?
Reply #4 - May 3rd, 2007 at 8:49am
 
looter,

What you see in the videos can be misleading. When I first joined Slinging.org I had the same impression, that some of these videos showed weak throws.

Part of that is true, as a majority here would agree that if you want accuracy, you need to start with gentle throws and work your way up. Part of it may be motivation, as there are many more reasons to sling than to obliterate things, or safety.

But the most startling thing that I've discovered over time is that a good fraction of these shots that looked weak were, in reality, not. Sling length, casting style, and camera angle can all create the illusion of a gentle throw. When I tried those same throws by slinging small rocks at bigger boulders, the resulting range and blast of rock shards was impressive every time.

It's also useful to remember that rocks are not arrows. One is made to penetrate, the other is made to smash things. I assure you that the rock that didn't go through the wooden Goliath would smash and shatter anything in its path. If the same mass of rock were shaped like an arrow, it would go through several Goliaths.

That's part of a sling's beauty, you don't need to grunt and sweat, veins popping and arms moving at light speed, in order to get a powerful throw. Try it yourself and be amazed.
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Re: Where are the powerful shots?
Reply #5 - May 3rd, 2007 at 9:21am
 
[quote author=curious_aardvark link=1178169061/0#3 date=1178191646]

Generally we have to trade off power for accuracy. And if the video you saw was of techstuff slinging through thick plywood and didn't strike you as powerful, then I'm surprised and you obviously don't know what you're seeing. Plywood is incredibly tough stuff due to the alternating grain of the veneers, it's like laminated armour.
:-)[/quote]


Amen Brother!!  Just try the same experiment with bow and see what sort of penetration you get. For that matter try it with an ax. Also remember that most of the videos are to demonstrate technique, ie slowed down a bit so you can see the action.
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wanderer
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Re: Where are the powerful shots?
Reply #6 - May 3rd, 2007 at 11:55am
 
Looter,

Even those 'wuss' shots will hurt! I think most of us who have been slinging for a little while have had a moment when we realise how powerful the sling is. Also, as has been pointed out, I think, the sling is more a 'technique' than a brute force weapon. At least in my personal experience I am amazed how little further I can throw when I apply 'maximum effort' compared with a very relaxed throw. The timing is very subtle, and that is where the power comes from. It took me something like three weeks (OK I'm a slow learner maybe) before I began to key in to that properly.

There are some powerful shots among the videos. Yurek's name rightly has been mentioned, and plywood Goliaths are a lot harder to kill than flesh and blood Wink.
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Re: Where are the powerful shots?
Reply #7 - May 3rd, 2007 at 5:07pm
 
A little experiment with 200 g metal projectiles and 23 mm thick plywood (~0.9 in). A relatively short sling has been used, 60 cm (24 in) in length, with the sidearm technique and almost full power. Long slings can give significantly higher starting velocities. Trying different styles and sling lengths can help you improve the throwing speed, but remember that before you achieve good power with any technique, some time needs to be invested into it.

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Re: Where are the powerful shots?
Reply #8 - May 3rd, 2007 at 8:02pm
 

Some pretty good penetration results Xenon!  Particle board is no match for a sling.....try 3/4" plywood.  Plywood, as CA said, is some tough stuff!  In the video, some may note that old Goliath had alot of give up top as well, which does absorb a considerable amount of impact force from stones nearly the size of one's fist.  Lead spheres or darts would make it look like rice paper.

Quote:
If the same mass of rock were shaped like an arrow, it would go through several Goliaths.


Pancaker, you got that right!  I wish I could find that VHS tape of a sling session I did back in '88.  On it, is a demonstration comparison between a compound bow and my Pro-Grip sling.  I used a sheet of 3/4" CDX plywood for the back stop with, if memory serves, a sheet of 1/2" plywood 4' behind it to catch my bearings.  (punny, I know, Dale)  I shot into the front sheet with the bow from about 10 meters with the arrows penetrating to a fairly wide degree of depths into the first sheet.  I then proceeded to sling 1" steel ball bearings through the first and sometimes second sheet.

If I had bothered to video some of my 6oz. field tipped dart casts through an old '73 Chrysler dinosaur.....well, my excuse is, I was 21yrs old and slinging failed to compete with other interests of the day.



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« Last Edit: May 3rd, 2007 at 10:08pm by Yahweh Bless you in Yeshua »  

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Mark
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Re: Where are the powerful shots?
Reply #9 - May 4th, 2007 at 12:40am
 
It's the speed of the pouch when the projectile leaves it that matters, not the speed during the windup.

The windup, whether it's five or six rotations slightly slower than the final throwing speed, or one slow one, puts the sling in the proper position for the final whip/throw/surge of power.
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Re: Where are the powerful shots?
Reply #10 - May 4th, 2007 at 12:53am
 


Search Yurek's posts....He typifies your observation well!


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« Last Edit: May 4th, 2007 at 2:03am by Yahweh Bless you in Yeshua »  

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Re: Where are the powerful shots?
Reply #11 - May 4th, 2007 at 6:43am
 
Looter - this isn't a 'let's all jump on the newbie' thread - honest :-)

But you will find that where slinging is concerned we tend to be a bit 'obsessive' (I don't feel that's too strong a word lol) so don't take it personally, if everyone wants to correct you  :-)
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Re: Where are the powerful shots?
Reply #12 - May 4th, 2007 at 11:28am
 

Well.....'looter' did use the terms 'experienced slingers' and 'wussy shots' in the same sentence.


It was a powderpuff welcome, all things considered.


Welcome to the forum.....uh.....'looter'.   Hooray!  Glad to see you my boy!


lol.


Ok, seriously......welcome to the forum, stick around you're sure to learn something valuable.


TS
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Dale
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Re: Where are the powerful shots?
Reply #13 - May 4th, 2007 at 3:24pm
 
Looter,

Welcome to our little community!  And, considering that you came out with guns blazing (so to speak), our response to your challenge has been quite restrained.  Some others have elicited much more vigorous reactions (Spencer and Vicente come to mind).

Now, I would like to know if you think that a powerful shot requires that the sling must be swung around and around to build up speed.  If you do think that, you are sadly mis-informed.  Swinging the sling around and around is not a way to have power, but a way to have confusion and a missed shot (perhaps even sending the stone BEHIND you!).

I have studied a couple of dozen different slinging styles (many variants of three basic styles), and none of them use more than a couple of twirls.  Those that use one or two rotations for wind-up, do so only so that one can get a "feel" for the rock in the sling.  All the power is applied in the last 180 degrees (or less) of the sling's travel.

Consider also (if you are American, or if you know the game) a baseball pitcher.  A fastball typically travels at about 90 miles per hour.  How many times did the pitcher spin his arm around and around, to build up speed?  Answer: NONE!  All that speed was applied to the ball in a single snap of his arm.  So it is with the sling.
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Re: Where are the powerful shots?
Reply #14 - May 4th, 2007 at 3:50pm
 
I knew when you first posted it this thread would become very entertaining...  thanks Looter and all the rest of you... it's all worth recording permanently.  It would make wonderful staged dialogue for the DVD...

Thanks again.
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