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Accuracy standard (Read 8682 times)
lololololol
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Re: Accuracy standard
Reply #15 - Feb 9th, 2007 at 12:07pm
 
This is a very interesting thread.

You guys here in this forum could be responsible for creating a real *standard*.  I don't know if there's a larger or more official panel of slingers anywhere in the world, but as far as I know this is the biggest, most active gathering anywhere.


Maybe 100yds is too much, but maybe you should establish some sort of *at least* unofficial standard.. even if it's just everyone here that uses it it would be a really useful tool of measure.  It could easily become the 'official' standard.

I'm thinking something like accuracy at 20/50/100 yards (yes all three).  Maybe not necessary to require a certain number of shots and instead just ask for percentage accuracy.


What do you guys think?
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Re: Accuracy standard
Reply #16 - Feb 9th, 2007 at 12:28pm
 
Some of you guys are still unbelievers!

1m at 100 sounds worse than it is. I bet some of you would be shocked given the chance. Of course finding a safe 100m range is another problem alltogether. My suggestion (cue broken record noises) is one of these:

...

At say... 45m? Wink The metal circle scores double. Anyone who haven't read through the Federacio Balear de Tir de Fona's webpages (lately) should really do so. Lots of photos from organised competition, as well as good records from past events. A perfectly reasonable accuracy standard, and one that the tennis-ball types can play too.

Matthias

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Re: Accuracy standard
Reply #17 - Feb 9th, 2007 at 9:14pm
 
lololololol wrote on Feb 9th, 2007 at 12:07pm:
This is a very interesting thread.

You guys here in this forum could be responsible for creating a real *standard*.  I don't know if there's a larger or more official panel of slingers anywhere in the world, but as far as I know this is the biggest, most active gathering anywhere.


Maybe 100yds is too much, but maybe you should establish some sort of *at least* unofficial standard.. even if it's just everyone here that uses it it would be a really useful tool of measure.  It could easily become the 'official' standard.

I'm thinking something like accuracy at 20/50/100 yards (yes all three).  Maybe not necessary to require a certain number of shots and instead just ask for percentage accuracy.


What do you guys think?


I agree with the idea and proposed similar myself but it has to be a set number of shots. Otherwise if you get lucky with your first few shots you quit whilst ahead and post your 100% score.
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Re: Accuracy standard
Reply #18 - Feb 10th, 2007 at 12:51am
 
I like the story but guess one could get out of it easier just asking "Got any skins?", with luck they'd laugh and not feel endangered if you seemed to approve, even if one didn't, it's got to be better getting stoned than stoning someone else and being killed or becoming a murderer.  Trees with smaller diameters than a metre one can hit, bark skinning branch braking hard, a high enough percentage of shots to make it meaningful at that range.  So you are not wasting your time training at medium range, if you have the luxury of a target at that take it.  But that is assuming one uses a casting style in the vertical plane and don't care to much how high one hits. it'd be a hard shot for horizontal casting styles.  The converse is of course true for horizontal targets.  Getting left/right accuracy with horizontal casts and high low with vertical ones may be the accuracy grail of target slinging.  So, as in the pic above a traditional circular target is a good idea. and if it is a meter across that would be great for the confidence, feels better to get a few central hits and a few on the edge than a few hits and some close misses even if it is the same really.  As to a standard how about thinking in terms of angles?   If hitting a target at 30 meters means keeping the shot trajectory within a triangle ( slinger at one point and each side of the target at the others ) of X degrees then double the size of the target for sixty meters so the angle of accuracy is the same.  This would make it easy to compare how well one did at different ranges.  If one doesn't mind shooting at squares instead of circles and some messing about setting up it could be easy to arrange:  stick poles in the ground to mark the sides and tie ribbons marking the top and bottom of the gap one is aiming at.  Not quite as much fun scoring goals as hitting hard targets but on the plus side shooting through gaps eliminates the danger of rebounds from accidental high power shots at short range targets.
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Re: Accuracy standard
Reply #19 - Feb 10th, 2007 at 5:13am
 
Decided to put my money where my mouth is and have a go at shooting at a proper target, and posting my score.

I cut a circle out of cardboard and painted it black. At 11'' diameter it was a bit smaller than the theoretical 12 " but the plastic bucket I used to trace around just happened to be that size. Armed with the target, some tape, my trusty sling and some tennis balls I set off to the local park. They have a tennis practise wall there; recently painted light grey and no graffiti yet. Just right for sticking the target to and trying my first measured accuracy attempt.

I had a good warm up with no target, just spraying shots everywhere, trying to hit individual bricks that make up the wall. Some of the bricks were quite cooperative allowing themselves to be hit, but others seemed to somehow repel the ball. No matter, must be the wind. Just wait till I have that nice black circle to aim at.

I stuck the target to the wall and stepped out 15 long paces. Now what was it? Yes three sighters followed by 20 shots. Just work out the percentage. What if my sighters all hit the target? Would they count as part of the twenty? The first sighter went a little to the right and a bit low. Second sighter hit exactly the same spot. Must make a correction. Third sighter was a flyer, way to the left. Well at least I won't be tempted to include them. Maybe I should practise some more? No! Committed now. Must start the test!

First shot - miss. Second shot - miss. By number seven - miss, I was thinking this may not be such a good idea. Finally, shot eight - whack. Hitting the cardboard made such a lovely whipcracking sound. I can't remember the exact order but by the time twenty shots were completed I'd heard that whipcrack only six times! My first posted score was going to have to be 30%

Sure, many of the others were oh so close. There was a bit of a wind blowing and that dog running by definitely distracted me. But the brutal truth was unavoidable, only six hits and fourteen misses.  Embarrassed

If all of you who requested my slings change your minds and send them back I will understand. I am a broken man. Cry

Aussieslinger
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Re: Accuracy standard
Reply #20 - Feb 10th, 2007 at 7:17am
 
i already posted an accuracy standard idea, which was shot to pieces by people who were determinded to find a problem to every solution. here it is again. the original idea was as follows

1. we have 3 standard targets at 10 metres, trash-can   (end on) football, and coke-can. 
ten shots at each, and results are given 
10/10/10 for ten hits on all three, or 7/3/0 or whatever you score.  any sling and any projectile can be used. 

2. distance is achieved with a sling of any material, in proprtion to the size of the slinger so it is not longer than arm-span of the shooter. the glande is a standard weight, eg a golf-ball, tennis ball, 4 ounce fishing weight - it doesn't matter as long as it's agreed. i suggest a golf-ball.
(NB this standard glande weight was later rejected as stones could be used)   

3. scoring is obtained by adding the target hits, plus the distance divided by 100 and rounded up to the nearest tenth.

4. example - i shoot a 7/4/1 and 146 metres. Tint shoots a 7/5/2 and 300 metres.  he scores 16.0 i score 13.5. 
along comes Techstuf with an incredible sling, and shoots 400 metres and 6/5/1 - he also gets a 16. by this means, expertise in distance adds less to the overall score than accuracy, so that strong men or skilled craftsmen with exotic materials can be competed against by old men like me, or girls and youths, on a more equal footing. 

5. the beauty of this system is that we can tell at a glance how skilled someone is, by a small line of figures. by saying that i'm a 7/3/0 and 100m or whatever it happens to be, everyone here will know exactly how skilled or unskilled i am.   for instance "he's a 8/7/5 320m" or "i'm  a novice, 3/0/0 75m" 
AND we can convert the combined accuracy/distance into a points system and compete!


NB this was later refined slightly thanks to ideas and objections from other forum members - for instance we couldn't agree on a standard glande - or even a standard trash can, coke can, or football, (the medium sized target was originally a sheet of newspaper, but differences in tabloid and broadsheet sizes vary from country to country! )      

so now we have 

1. large target not exceeeding 1/4 sq metre 

2. meduim target, standard soccer ball 

3. small target, upright drinks can not exceeding 500mls

4. distance = freestyle with stone. must be a stone!

5. the same sling  must be used for target and distance. 

6. score by adding number of hits on large medium and 
    small target, plus distance in metres/100            

7. range to targets is 10 metres. 

NB description easily understood by other slingers, as described. 
eg 10/7/2/125 (or whatever it happens to be) 
-which gives a points score of 20.3 

NOTE; the distance has been divided by 100 and added to the target score to give an overall points value


sv
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Re: Accuracy standard
Reply #21 - Feb 10th, 2007 at 12:19pm
 
I am not trained at guessing distances. But I would say that most of my throws ended up 30 to 50 meters away. The strange thing about that is it didn't matter what size and weight the stones had. So today I figured up that I put too much tension in my muscles and that slowed me down. I did it a bit more relaxed and my range increased a lot. (I still wouldn't hit anything no matter how far it is away).

I will keep training until I can at least hit an apple at 600 meters!  Wink

Aussie wrote on Feb 10th, 2007 at 5:13am:
But the brutal truth was unavoidable, only six hits and fourteen misses.  Embarrassed


Sounds better than most I managed.

Aussie wrote on Feb 10th, 2007 at 5:13am:
If all of you who requested my slings change your minds and send them back I will understand. I am a broken man. Cry


No way! That is the best pouch I have currently! Wink
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Re: Accuracy standard
Reply #22 - Feb 10th, 2007 at 5:04pm
 
Hi SV,

I have never seen your proposed standard before but it looks really good! The only thing I am not sure of is large target at 1/4 sq.m. Do you mean 25cm x 25cm or a circle of 56cm diameter(which has an area of 0.25 sq.m) Maybe an idea to define all targets by actual dimensions as well as what they are.

Anyway I'm going to give it a go as soon as my ego recovers from the bruising it took yesterday! What difference does it make if not everybody likes it. We (generally) live in democracies, we're supposed to be different! I'll post my SV score.

Hi Dravonk,

Your encouraging comment is going a long way to help my recovery. Just remember, if the sling wears out, or you just need another one don't hesitate to ask.

SV, maybe you would like one too?



Regards,      Aussieslinger
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Re: Accuracy standard
Reply #23 - Feb 11th, 2007 at 3:21am
 
I like SV's system.

It allows some reasonable comparison over a wide range of skill which seems like a good thing.

At the risk of pedantry, though Wink - and on the basis that if you leave a loophole then someone will find a way to exploit it (perhaps me Cheesy)...

If hitting includes 'grazing' - the effective size of the target will depend on how big your projectile is won't it?

Now just wait until I figure out how to sling that football...
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Re: Accuracy standard
Reply #24 - Feb 11th, 2007 at 4:09am
 
True that this system can be abused, as can any system that relies on the honour of the competitor, but why should anyone cheat? After all it's ony friendly fun, we're not competing for mega prize money.

Aussieslinger
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Re: Accuracy standard
Reply #25 - Feb 11th, 2007 at 7:18am
 
thanks for that guys. the 1/4 sq metre target was eventually arrived at because people couldn't agree on trash-can sizes, newspaper sizes etc, which were approximately the sizes i had in mind
i eventually got tired of the gurning from certain members and dropped the subject. it should be tin can, football, open end of trash-can, and maximum distance - simple!
here's me gettng a good hit on the medium target. any trash can would do, it's just for fun, not an olympic standard

http://www.slinging.org/movies/badger/accuracy.mov


   
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Re: Accuracy standard
Reply #26 - Feb 11th, 2007 at 8:29am
 
Aussie wrote on Feb 11th, 2007 at 4:09am:
True that this system can be abused, as can any system that relies on the honour of the competitor, but why should anyone cheat?


Point taken, aussieslinger - but I was just trying to make the point that for a small target like a drinks can it makes quite a difference whether you use a golf ball or a tennis ball. Not that I'm likely to 'trouble the scorers' with a drinks can at 10m with either of those projectiles at present.
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Re: Accuracy standard
Reply #27 - Feb 11th, 2007 at 8:39am
 
the trash can is of course the large target - it seems smaller when you're trying to hit it

sv
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Re: Accuracy standard
Reply #28 - Feb 11th, 2007 at 12:20pm
 
Look the length of the sling, height or religion or favourite chewing gum of the competitor is irrelevant.

You have a range and a target - the competitor uses whatever sling, ammo abd style they feel most accurate with.
Why complicate things unnecessarily. The ultimate end is to get an object to a certain point using a sling - anything else is pointlessly complicated.
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Re: Accuracy standard
Reply #29 - Feb 11th, 2007 at 2:09pm
 
Greetings SV,

Thanks for the video. I like your style. I would love to see it in the guides and articles section with a bit of a preamble by yourself. It would be great for those who are starting out to see how it's done.

Aussieslinger
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