Slinging.org Forum - Torsion for Siege Weapons

CanDo

Interfector Viris Spurii
Past Moderator

Offline

Posts: 1652
New England, USA
Gender: male

Torsion for Siege Weapons
Jan 20^th, 2007 at 12:25pm

Hi all,
I'm thinking of building some sort of siege or 'artillery-like' ancient weapon. I'd like to play with torsion, but none of my long-haired friends are willing to shave their head Tongue

. I've heard word of using synthetic or nylon rope as a substitute, and am wondering if any of you have had any experience with it. Just how it worked in general (any problems?), but info on how it stacks up against more tradional materials would be excellent. Thanks.

Back to top

http://funditor.org&&http://wiki.funditor.org

&&&&http://www.hostedscripts.com/scripts/antispam.html&&

IP Logged

Stenny Funditor Offline Don't laugh at me, I can sling in every direction! Posts: 654 Gender:	Re: Torsion for Siege Weapons Reply #1 - Jan 20^th, 2007 at 5:21pm Your local saddlery (is there any such thing??) or horse-riding club may be able to get you horse hair, which is most excellent for torsion ropes...
Back to top	Slinger, martial artist, knife thrower, blowgunner and general weirdo since 1998.&&Proud owner of official Zombie hunting permit and scars to prove it's worth.&&Underestimating a fighter or a weapon is the surest way to make plastic surgeons happy. IP Logged

slingbadger Interfector Viris Spurii Offline Don't Badger a Badger Posts: 3220 Akron NY Gender:	Re: Torsion for Siege Weapons Reply #2 - Jan 21^st, 2007 at 10:59am Any natural rope like hemp or sisal should work too. I don't know about cotton, but I don't think it would have the strength
Back to top	The greatest of all the accomplishments of 20th cent. science has been the discovery of human ignorance The main difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has it's limits.-Einstein I'm getting psychic as I get older. Or is that psychotic? IP Logged

Selin Junior Member Offline Posts: 55 Sydney, Australia Gender:	Re: Torsion for Siege Weapons Reply #3 - Feb 2^nd, 2007 at 5:09am Is flax strong enough? I'd reccomend silk for its strength, but...
Back to top	IP Logged

slingbadger

Interfector Viris Spurii

Offline

Don't Badger a Badger

Posts: 3220
Akron NY
Gender: male

Re: Torsion for Siege Weapons
Reply #4 - Feb 2^nd, 2007 at 8:47am

Flax should work, since it was used for ropes. The main thing with a torsion catapult, is when it is not in use, the ropes must be untightened, or they will simply stretch and become useless. Also, they cannot get wet, so even a high humidity day presents problems.
makes you wonder how our ancestors dealt with all of this. I suppose they could have tarred the ropes to helpwith the moisture.

Back to top

The greatest of all the accomplishments of 20th cent. science has been the discovery of human ignorance The main difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has it's limits.-Einstein I'm getting psychic as I get older. Or is that psychotic?

IP Logged

Selin Junior Member Offline Posts: 55 Sydney, Australia Gender:	Re: Torsion for Siege Weapons Reply #5 - Feb 3^rd, 2007 at 5:24am Or greased/waxed it I suppose...
Back to top	IP Logged

Jaz

Descens

Offline

Posts: 126
Gender: male

Re: Torsion for Siege Weapons
Reply #6 - Feb 3^rd, 2007 at 5:56am

slingbadger wrote on Feb 2^nd, 2007 at 8:47am:

Flax should work, since it was used for ropes. The main thing with a torsion catapult, is when it is not in use, the ropes must be untightened, or they will simply stretch and become useless. Also, they cannot get wet, so even a high humidity day presents problems.
makes you wonder how our ancestors dealt with all of this. I suppose they could have tarred the ropes to helpwith the moisture.

I think I remember reading somewhere that the ropes were stored in special oils or something when not in use to preserve them. Or maybe it was to reduce the amount they stretched.

Back to top

IP Logged

LKH9 Funditor Offline Posts: 824 Malaysia Gender:	Re: Torsion for Siege Weapons Reply #7 - Feb 3^rd, 2007 at 6:02am Will modern materials like nylon work?
Back to top	IP Logged

Jaz Descens Offline Posts: 126 Gender:	Re: Torsion for Siege Weapons Reply #8 - Feb 3^rd, 2007 at 6:18am LKH9 wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2007 at 6:02am: Will modern materials like nylon work? I think that's pretty much what CanDo is wondering. But I don't know the answer.
Back to top	IP Logged

Willeke Interfector Viris Spurii Past Moderator Offline Give me some string and I know what to do. Posts: 2072 Netherlands Gender:	Re: Torsion for Siege Weapons Reply #9 - Feb 3^rd, 2007 at 7:04am I think the question should be "Which modern rope will work?" Because there are so many, all of them with different properties. Willeke
Back to top	"Never underestimate what a simple person can do with clever tools, nor what a clever person can do with simple tools." - Ian Fieggen - Writer of A booklet on lanyards, PM for info - Member IGKT, Netherlands Bad spellers of the world: untie! IP Logged

slingbadger Interfector Viris Spurii Offline Don't Badger a Badger Posts: 3220 Akron NY Gender:	Re: Torsion for Siege Weapons Reply #10 - Feb 3^rd, 2007 at 11:08am Nylon should work, but it has a greater stretch potential that the others. Not to mention bright yellow nylon looks gawdawfukl on an otherwise accurate catapult
Back to top	The greatest of all the accomplishments of 20th cent. science has been the discovery of human ignorance The main difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has it's limits.-Einstein I'm getting psychic as I get older. Or is that psychotic? IP Logged

CanDo

Interfector Viris Spurii
Past Moderator

Offline

Posts: 1652
New England, USA
Gender: male

Re: Torsion for Siege Weapons
Reply #11 - Feb 3^rd, 2007 at 11:43am

slingbadger wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2007 at 11:08am:

Nylon should work, but it has a greater stretch potential that the others. Not to mention bright yellow nylon looks gawdawfukl on an otherwise accurate catapult

Greater stretch potential as in more power or as in that one must be more careful since it could stretch out, and lose its elasticity easier? If you're thinking of that bright yellow, plasticy rope, I don't think that's nylon, but some sort of synthetic... Nylon is soft and comes in just about any color, or pattern of colors (though I think it costs a lot more than that stiff yellow stuff).

Back to top

http://funditor.org&&http://wiki.funditor.org

&&&&http://www.hostedscripts.com/scripts/antispam.html&&

IP Logged

Matthias

Past Moderator

Offline

Posts: 1418
Gatineau/Ottawa QC, Canada
Gender: male

Re: Torsion for Siege Weapons
Reply #12 - Feb 3^rd, 2007 at 12:19pm

The yellow/blue three strand stuff is polypropylene. It's cheap, which is a plus, and easy to find. I'd probably be tempted to start with that (if I didn't have access to thousands of pounds of rope Wink

) and then switch it out once the thing was built if it looked like doing so would give me any real benefit.

A CanDo said, raw nylon is soft and white, and quite stretchy. It would probably be your best bet, and you could dye it (cheap fabric dye - eg: RIT). Might be a little harder to find, and it will be more expensive. I'd stay away from the polyesters - dacron etc. and anything remotely "high tech". If your ropes don't have abit of elasticity you are basically making a giant wooden-frame-breaking-machine.

None of the synthetics will have too much problem with set in this type of application. They will all stretch in a bit with use, but will quickly get to a point where you get back virtually all of the energy that you put in.

Matthias

Back to top

IP Logged

CanDo

Interfector Viris Spurii
Past Moderator

Offline

Posts: 1652
New England, USA
Gender: male

Re: Torsion for Siege Weapons
Reply #13 - Feb 3^rd, 2007 at 3:38pm

Matthias wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2007 at 12:19pm:

The yellow/blue three strand stuff is polypropylene. It's cheap, which is a plus, and easy to find. I'd probably be tempted to start with that (if I didn't have access to thousands of pounds of rope Wink

) and then switch it out once the thing was built if it looked like doing so would give me any real benefit.

A CanDo said, raw nylon is soft and white, and quite stretchy. It would probably be your best bet, and you could dye it (cheap fabric dye - eg: RIT). Might be a little harder to find, and it will be more expensive. I'd stay away from the polyesters - dacron etc. and anything remotely "high tech". If your ropes don't have abit of elasticity you are basically making a giant wooden-frame-breaking-machine.

None of the synthetics will have too much problem with set in this type of application. They will all stretch in a bit with use, but will quickly get to a point where you get back virtually all of the energy that you put in.

Matthias

Ahh, great, thanks for the info. Yes polypropylene is the stuff I was thinking of. So does this mean that moisture/humidity is a concern with the synthetics?

Is twisted preffered to braided, or does it really not matter?

Back to top

http://funditor.org&&http://wiki.funditor.org

&&&&http://www.hostedscripts.com/scripts/antispam.html&&

IP Logged