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flattening leaf springs (Read 6977 times)
nakram
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flattening leaf springs
Mar 16th, 2006 at 5:25pm
 
on my way home from school today i found a brocken section of leaf spring and im thinking of making some knives out of it
but i have a question to flatten it could i just put it on the concreat and smack it flat with a sledge hammer?
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Re: flattening leaf springs
Reply #1 - Mar 16th, 2006 at 5:31pm
 
you should probably do a little research on the internet before you do anything.  i suggest not flattening it all. personally, i like big, thick knoves with a wide bevel down to the edge of the blade.  for this, you would cut out the shape with maybe a scroll saw or band saw or something, and then grind the edge onto it with a bench grinder or belt sander.
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Re: flattening leaf springs
Reply #2 - Mar 16th, 2006 at 5:43pm
 
Would that get it hot and destory the temper? I used a hack saw but boy does your way sound easer!
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Re: flattening leaf springs
Reply #3 - Mar 16th, 2006 at 5:56pm
 
Smacking it with a hammer will not work.  It is spring steal so it'll just bounce back to shape and create a whole in the concrete.  You can cut and grind it, but you will have to becareful not to get it hot, or it will lose its temper (hardness).  Theres several good books on the this subject.  Try to find a copy of Edge of the Anvil.
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Re: flattening leaf springs
Reply #4 - Mar 16th, 2006 at 7:23pm
 
You are going to need a plasma cutter to cut up a leaf spring. How thick is that leaf spring? Is it like a half inch thick (dumptruck leafspring)? Or is it about an eighth of an inch thick (volkswagon leafspring)? I suggest you go over to a steel mill or a precision cutting plant so you can get that cut up, might cost a bit though. And grinding it is a royal b!tc@, unless you have a wide access to a variety of good tools. If it turns a cherry red while grinding then I suggest you quench it quick in motor oil. Dont take out the temper though.
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Re: flattening leaf springs
Reply #5 - Mar 16th, 2006 at 8:07pm
 
Quote:
If it turns a cherry red while grinding then I suggest you quench it quick in motor oil. Dont take out the temper though.


If You quench the steel in oil (or water) it will be hardended. Let it cool naturally or don't let it get that hot.

Quote:
on my way home from school today i found a brocken section of leaf spring and im thinking of making some knives out of it
but i have a question to flatten it could i just put it on the concreat and smack it flat with a sledge hammer?


You will first have to anneal (soften) the steel. Then pound it to shape. Then re harden it. Or go get some other steel.
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Re: flattening leaf springs
Reply #6 - Mar 17th, 2006 at 7:26pm
 
I don't know about you, but I'm pretty damn lazy. I'd just make the knife blade small enough so you couldn't see the curve in it. How big a knife do you need, anyway?
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Re: flattening leaf springs
Reply #7 - Mar 17th, 2006 at 7:43pm
 
anyone know how to tell the difference between steel with a good carbon content and iron? i spent a few hours making the handle and blade for a knive out of red oak and an old sawzall blade. all was going very well....too well, until i tried to re harden the steel. file can scratch it very easily and it won't hold an edge for long. being a sawzall blade, i assumed that it was good steel and annealed it before checking. now that i think about it though, this blade was made for cutting steel, and instead of teeth, uses a really gritty, hard substance. So is it possible that the the blade itself is just iron? I'm hoping that I hardened it wrong, but the more that I think about it, the more likely it seems that it can't be made into a knife
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Re: flattening leaf springs
Reply #8 - Mar 17th, 2006 at 7:58pm
 
Quote:
an old sawzall blade. all was going very well....too well, until i tried to re harden the steel. file can scratch it very easily and it won't hold an edge for long. being a sawzall blade, i assumed that it was good steel and annealed it before checking. now that i think about it though, this blade was made for cutting steel, and instead of teeth, uses a really gritty, hard substance. So is it possible that the the blade itself is just iron? I'm hoping that I hardened it wrong, but the more that I think about it, the more likely it seems that it can't be made into a knife


A sawzall blade? Is that like a wood cutting saw with square teeth? If so the really gritty hard substance is called carbide. Not good for making knife blades. If the blade is a wood cutting blade it proably has a mild to soft steel and then carbide teeth
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Re: flattening leaf springs
Reply #9 - Mar 17th, 2006 at 9:36pm
 
sawzall is a reciporacating saw basically made for rough cuts and rapid destruction of anything. There are interchangeable blades, most of which are made for cutting through wood with nails. This particular one was made for cutting hard materials, it's on the short side for sawzall blades about five inches. Pictures coming soon, but I'm having a bit of trouble with the camera...
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Re: flattening leaf springs
Reply #10 - Mar 17th, 2006 at 9:47pm
 
alright here are the pics...looking back, there is no way i spent three hours working on that.... but it's been a couple days of intermittent work.

...
Close-up of the cutting edge (back of the knife blade) ...
In one of the scales I cut out an indent for the tang to lie perfectly flush. ...
...
The taper at the back of the handle makes it infitely more comfortable for the palm than a straight back. I might even make it a bit more extreme (if I end up finishing this at all).
Any thoughts?

Edit:
Note: I'd definitely clean up the steel if this works out.
And another question: Is the type of barstock steel that you'd buy in a hardware store annealed?



MORE INFORMATION: it was heated with Mapp Gas (hotter than propane) and quenched in 50:1 2 cycle motor oil (not mixed with gas of course  Shocked)
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nakram
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Re: flattening leaf springs
Reply #11 - Mar 18th, 2006 at 6:25am
 
ok the leaf spring is an eighth of an inch thick, the knife blade i want to be is 5 inches, yesterday i got my dad to anneal it for me now the only problem is iv run out of angle grinder blades
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Re: flattening leaf springs
Reply #12 - Mar 18th, 2006 at 8:12am
 
Nakram , if its annealed then draw filing is an option . Instead of filing in the usual manner draw file by taking the knife an securing it with a vise , or c clamp ,or perhaps a large vise grip on a sturdy surface. A heavy work bench or picnic table would do. With the knife pointing right at you apply the file on bevel you are working on and draw the file along the edge . This motion does not resemble usual filing . With a little experimentation you'll get it and the bevel will even out smoothly .  Wink

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Re: flattening leaf springs
Reply #13 - Mar 18th, 2006 at 6:13pm
 
Quote:
Edit: 
Note: I'd definitely clean up the steel if this works out.
And another question: Is the type of barstock steel that you'd buy in a hardware store annealed?
 


1st. If the steel is the everyday run of the mill cheap steel at the hardware store, then yes it is annealed. And it will stay annealed too. Cheap steel DOES NOT have enough carbon(the material that makes steel harder than iron) in it to get hard enough for a knife. The steel might ROCKWELL about 4 or 5 without heat treatment, and MAYBE a 20 rockwell when heat treated. I knife needs to be about 50- 62 rockwell (depending on the length and girth of the knife. Longer knives need about 50- 55 and normal length knife about 55-62) Cheap steel WILL not hold the edge without hardness. You need some 1095 tool steel (yes it will come in unharded state). The cheap steel is just that cheap, however, that doesn't mean that it is not bad to practice on. It would be benafical to practice with it.
When you get everything down packed then you need some steel with some carbon in it. Old file make great knives. Anneal them, work them,  reharden them, and then temper them (means to stress releave the steel. If you don't it will be to hard and break because it will be too britle. Case knive are double temperd).

Quote:
 
Is the type of barstock steel that you'd buy in a hardware store annealed?


All steel when bought from any supplier will be in a soft state.

Quote:
MORE INFORMATION: it was heated with Mapp Gas (hotter than propane) and quenched in 50:1 2 cycle motor oil (not mixed with gas of course 


When you heat the steel it has to be at a certain temperture to be hardend right. There are several ways to do this. First you could have a steel oven and set the temp and then you would know what temp it is at. 2nd you could tell by the color of the steel. Since i am pretty sure you are not a experanced blacksmith or welder that may not work. 3rd, when steel get to the desired temp, if you put a magnet to it, it WILL not stick. If it sticks then it need to be hotter. If it sticks then quench it. As for your method of cooling it. You can use water, oil, or air. If you buy o2 tool steel, then use oil. If you use a2 tool steel the use air. I would not recomend 50 to 1 two cylcle motor oil. As it burns (?) in the engine. I would use the cheap motor oil. 30 weight with now detergent. Used motor oil will work too as it has extra carbon in it from use. It will add a little carbon to the steel.

I am a machinists that has to heat treat metal. I am not a blacksmith. I good blacksmith may be able to turn cheap steel with little carbon in it in to a usable knife (by adding carbon). But because i am not a blacksmith i would not know how to tell you how to do it. Lobohunter hear on this board is the master blacksmith so maybe he could help you with that.
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Re: flattening leaf springs
Reply #14 - Mar 18th, 2006 at 10:29pm
 
Wow, thanks! I'm definitely going to give the magnet tip a try, I'm running a bit low on mapp gas so i'll try propane next. I found a whole store of various oils in my garage that I completely forgot about, so 30 weight oil should be no problem.

If this blade is hopeless, I'll try to find an old mider saw blade somewhere.
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