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composite sling (Read 3772 times)
Altay
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Romans 8

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Re: composite sling
Reply #15 - Mar 6th, 2006 at 12:52am
 
Goliath would've had years of military experience and training. This can hardly be compared with killing a lion. There is no opponent as hard to match as a human. Doubtless David was an incredible slinger, but he couldn't even use a sword!! He took with him a staff instead. If God wasn't on David's side (doubtless this statement will bring in many comments from athiests and other non-Christians... Tongue) there's no doubt Goliath would have obliterated David. I mean seriously:

Goliath- Level 30 Soldier
   Full bronze armor (125 pounds)
   Helmet
   Spear (15 pound spearhead)
   Sword
   Shield


David- Level 16 Shepherd
   Staff
   Sling
   5 rocks

hmm... Goliath had the advantage both ranged (65 pound spear vs. smooth rock) and melee (sword vs. staff). In any RTS David would lose every time. Maybe there should be God in RTS too. LOL. That would change the games a bit. Grin
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Tint
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Re: composite sling
Reply #16 - Mar 6th, 2006 at 1:13am
 
I don't think the spear Goliath carried was not ment for throwing.  Even if he did throw it I doubt he could match David's range with a sling.
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Altay
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Re: composite sling
Reply #17 - Mar 6th, 2006 at 1:16am
 
Then why did he carry a sling and a sword? ??? You can't use both, can you? One for throwing & one for close combat. As for range... yeah, David would be able to sling farther, but at a moving target. I doubt his range advantage would make a big difference.
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Re: composite sling
Reply #18 - Mar 6th, 2006 at 2:12am
 
It is likely that they are standard gear of his army.  Just like a soldier nowadays would carry a hand gun and a machine gun.  

As for David's advantage.  He was not wearing armror, so he could probably out run Goliath and therefore always keep himself a fair distance away.  We'll never know how accurate he is with the sling but I wouldn't count out the possiblilty that he is very accurate and was confident that he could hit his opponet with it.  This make sense to me if he had hit a lion before.
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Re: composite sling
Reply #19 - Mar 6th, 2006 at 12:14pm
 
a spear that heavy would only be good for very short throws (compared to the slings range anyway). Also, I wouldn't want to try,  but it's probably a lot easier to dodge a spear than a rock. Once the spear is thrown there's no ranged weapon. So, Goliath would've only thrown it if he had a fairly certain kill, meaning he'd have to have been very close... David wasn't stupid.

Also, if David had been practicing with the sling ever since he was big enough to hold one, he'd be extremely accurate with it. Theres speculation that the condidtion which made Goliath a giant "enlarged pituatary gland' would also have pressed against the optical center of his brain, limiting his peripheral vision, allowing David to approach him un seen.

I don't think Goliath really had a chance...
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CanDo
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Re: composite sling
Reply #20 - Mar 6th, 2006 at 12:34pm
 
it turns out that my school has a copy of the Bible...

David was given chainmail, a helmet, and a sword but he refused them not because they were too big, but because he had not 'tried them'.
Also, it appears as though he was extremely confident of his own ability (for some of the same reasons I guessed earlier). "I am my father's shepherd; when a lion or bear comes and carries off a a sheep from the flock, I go after it and attack it and rescue the victim from its jaws. Then if it turns on me, I seize it by the beard and battre it to death" also... to Goliath "You have come against me with sword and spear and dagger, but I have come against you in the name of the LORD of Hosts, The God of the army of Israel which you have defied. The LORD will put you into my power this day; I will kill you and cut your head off and leave your carcass and the carcasses of the Phili....."
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Re: composite sling
Reply #21 - Mar 6th, 2006 at 6:22pm
 
My point was that David wasn't arrogant, and Goliath was. He was confident in his God, not in himself. He said "The LORD will put you into my power this day." Also, I don't think David snuck up on Goliath. Their battle was between the two camps (Isreal & Philistene). Everyone was watching. If David was too small for standard armor (and chainmail is really one size fits all -- it molds to your body) then he couldn't have been too much of a warrior. By the way, only the 3 oldest sons went to the war and David was the 9th oldest (youngest). That means he had 5 older brothers who weren't fit for war.
I don't think David planned to outrange Goliath by "running and firing from a safe distance. According to I Samuel 17:48, "As the Philistine moved closer to attack him, David ran quickly toward the battle line to meet him." It doesn't sound like a ranged battle. Both charged at each other.
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Re: composite sling
Reply #22 - Mar 6th, 2006 at 8:29pm
 
it has to be written that way to ensure that people don't think of David as a coward  Roll Eyes
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Re: composite sling
Reply #23 - Mar 6th, 2006 at 10:01pm
 
Certainly he was no coward. He was incredibly brave and trusting (God, that is). I didn't mean to imply that. In fact, I meant the opposite. I was trying to say that the odds being against him made him braver. Sorry if you thought I was saying he was a coward. Tongue

EDIT: You can see how much our discussion has to do with the composite sling Wink
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Re: composite sling
Reply #24 - Mar 7th, 2006 at 9:31am
 
not a lot with the sling but its very intresting never the less but really what evidence is there that david or goliath ever Really went at it ?  Undecided i'm not very sure i want to take a story as fact from a book that tells of a man splitting a sea for his people to escape.. its a nice story but that would be all it is  Undecided sure they escaped egypt but did they really walk thru that sea ? sure david and goliath might have fought but are those surcomstances for real???
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Re: composite sling
Reply #25 - Mar 7th, 2006 at 4:15pm
 
Hmm, interesting.  In another thread, several of us discussed the fight between David and Goliath, and we were quoting various bits of Samuel's first book in which the fight was described.  At the time, I argued that David must have been about as big as Saul, because Saul dressed David in his own armor.  I didn't consider that maybe Saul's armor was mail, and I certainly didn't know that mail is one-size-fits-all.

No, the fight was not an ambush.  Goliath had time to see David approach and size him up ... or down.  Goliath was quite contemptuous of this unbearded youth armed with a staff (Goliath didn't mention the sling, I don't know if he didn't notice it or if he totally discounted it).  Must have been quite a sight for the Israeli and Philistine soldiers: virtually unarmed youth, against a seasoned warrior who stood "six cubits and a span" -- 9.75 feet or almost three metres1!

So everybody on both sides saw David sling a stone and saw Goliath fall.  Since "the stone sank into his forehead," Goliath was killed (blunt force trauma, bone fragments all through his brain...) but so that the armies were certain Goliath was dead, David took off his head -- with Goliath's own sword! -- and held it up for all to see.

Now as for the veracity of the Bible, that's a whole 'nother discussion and one that probably doesn't belong here.  But I will note that archaeologists have repeatedly found terrain and cities where the Bible says they were.  I think the historical accounts are also accurate.

1
A cubit is traditionally the length from elbow to tip of middle finger, about 18 inches or 457 cm; a span is the distance between outstretched pinky tip and thumb tip, or half a cubit.
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Romans 8

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Re: composite sling
Reply #26 - Mar 7th, 2006 at 9:06pm
 
The Bible is more historically accurate (more original copies made sooner after the events took place) than Julius Caesar's invasion of Gaul. Or so I've been told (by a reliable source). I don't mean to start this discussion here. You're right, it belongs somewhere else.

On second thought, half the discussions here have little/nothng to do with slings, so almost anything seems to belong. Wink
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