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You guys are going to like this... (Read 19813 times)
Matthias
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You guys are going to like this...
Aug 3rd, 2005 at 5:36pm
 
With thanks to Neolyth and FunSlinger - I just spent the morning finishing up a signal-whip style sling, which I am just going to call a "signal sling" from now on. He answers a few questions that we talked about in a Neolyth's recent thread, and a couple that have been hanging around for a while as well.

...
First off - Material. I have been holding onto this spool of lead cored trolling line for a while. I made one experimental sling out of it (that could throw ping pong balls!), but never really had a plan. It is great stuff if you like knots, as the lead core really makes it nice to work with, while hilding knots beautifully.

...
I started out with a "braid on a string" on four strands to form the finger loop.

...
The core is then round braided using the eight strands from the finger loop + four additional strands (two doubled - the blue is one "tracer" pair). The braid is continued, dropping strands to taper the core. I split to two three stand braids (same as a Balearic style) for the pouch, then back to a round braid. Eventually, the core drops down to two strands, that I twist together for the last little bit.

...
I was originally planning on doing one braided belly with an eight-plait overlay, so I started the next layer with twelve strands (six doubled) and plaited the cover using a standard four-type braid.

...
Strands are dropped to taper the braid again. The covers for the pouch cords are the same four-braid, with four strands each.

...
When I finished up the first layer, I started to have second thoughts about adding a third. One, it was going to be a whole lot more work Wink, particularily since I wanted to do a more complicated pattern, but also the sling was feeling pretty heavy as it was. I wanted a sling that could crack, not a whip that would sling, so I finished off the braid with a eyesplice and tied on a nylon fall/cracker. The loop and lark's head knot form the grip point for the sling. The leather pouch was sewn to the frame cords.

...
Closeup of both ends, showing the amount of taper (twenty-four to four strands in the sling), the attachment point and the "cracker".

....

Do does it crack? Now keep in mind that I've never played with whips, and haven't ever really been interested. To be honest, I don't own any tight black leather pants, which seems to be a bit of a prerequisite... There was some concern expressed about whether the pouch would slow it down, and I put a solid leather one.

I was expecting a wet towel type *pop*... I mean this is a pretty tiny whip as far as things go, and who knows how to swing the thing.

I wasn't expecting a forest reverberating, neighbour police-phoning, altogether startling thunderclap of a *CRACK*...  Shocked

Ok so now maybe I understand why people like playing with these things. (I have a pretty good idea why they trend toward leather pants as well - I'd be wearing my full fencing getup before I'd try anything bigger than this little guy).

Next question is "does it sling ok"? Feels really good! I think the retention stiffness and cord weight really do contribute to a more accurate release. The other good news is that the rock seems to help direct the sling to not whip back at you if you screw up. This might just be due to much more practise with the sling than the whip.

That said, does the rock inhibit the cracking? Not at all! In fact, for my mediocre newfound whip cracking skills, it seems to make it even easier/louder! It seems a little funny, as the slinging motion is nothing like a standard whip crack, with the energy stored in the retention side hardly contributing? (maybe should have thought about that before I braided twenty four strands up there...) I don't know - but I do know that it cracks effortlessly while slinging. Range doesn't seem to be affected at all either - if I didn't know better I'd say I was getting a little more power...

....

I thought you guys deserved a video. Quality is not great, and the sound recording is mediocre at best, so the crack is not really as pronounced as it is when you are standing right next to it. A plane flew over too. Turn up the volume and enjoy!

Click here to watch Whip Sling



Matthias
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« Last Edit: Sep 8th, 2006 at 1:07pm by Matthias »  
 
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Dale
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Re: You guys are going to like this...
Reply #1 - Aug 3rd, 2005 at 6:35pm
 
I've been trying for five minutes to organize a coherent expression of what I feel watching that video.  I can't come up with anything better than this:

WOW!!
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Re: You guys are going to like this...
Reply #2 - Aug 3rd, 2005 at 6:46pm
 
jesus christ on a bike!!!!
sv
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Matthias
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Re: You guys are going to like this...
Reply #3 - Aug 3rd, 2005 at 7:54pm
 
Oh man, this thing is hilarious... I need to un-mod myself for a few minutes so I can let loose with whole string of expletives expressing how *&^%ing cool this is Grin. I can't stop grinning - even after I raised a nice welt on my leg (AFAGUSLAE ...).

So now the question is how to make one to a slightly more accessible design? I need three or four more! I guess next thing to try is shot loaded core so that I'm not relying on the leadline for mass. I'm going to see what I can come up with... big roll of duct tape, some bicycle inner tube and... Cane anyone think of a cheap, quick, and relatively available source for heavy tapered flexible cords? We need a paracord-simple equivalent to get more of these in circulation.

Matthias
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Re: You guys are going to like this...
Reply #4 - Aug 3rd, 2005 at 7:57pm
 
what about electrical flex?
sv
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Re: You guys are going to like this...
Reply #5 - Aug 3rd, 2005 at 8:13pm
 
That sounds like one of those sheperd slings. Very cool sling Matthias.
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Matthias
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Re: You guys are going to like this...
Reply #6 - Aug 3rd, 2005 at 9:02pm
 
Yes, the weighted strands used here are a pretty uncommon way to vary the mass dist. What I meant I guess was: are there any easy/ready made core materials that would open this up to the non-braiders. The paracord slings are rightly popular since all you need to do is cut them to length and tie a couple of knots. We need something like that.

I've already made a bicycle tube whip since my last post. (BTW if you want to avoid looking like an S&M whip-type, you probably also want to avoid black rubber whips...) and if you had a non-structural core and tapered cover strands, you could probably get away with one pass of fours strand braid. Pretty quick - the pocket remains a problem as the contruction gets simpler...

I'm on it though.

sv - Electrical cord might be a reasonable core (I've seen whips like this on the web) but you need to taper the mass, which means binding more than one cord together, which means you sort of need to cover it, which puts you back to braiding...

me - Have you been able to crack a shepherd's sling like this? I get a mild chuff from some of my heavier braids, but nothing like the boom this one produces. I'm very interested in other's experiences!

Matthias

(I'll send the video to Chris a bit later - maybe I'll get someone to help me make a better one...)
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Re: You guys are going to like this...
Reply #7 - Aug 3rd, 2005 at 9:42pm
 
That is the coolest sling I have seen to this day! Shocked

You can flock sheeps and tame lions at the same time!?? Roll Eyes

Thanks for sharing.  How long did it take for you to make it?

You talked about making money with your design in another thread........If you want to start a business selling  those whip cracking slings, I am sure you'll get plenty of business Wink
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Re: You guys are going to like this...
Reply #8 - Aug 3rd, 2005 at 11:43pm
 
Quote:
me - Have you been able to crack a shepherd's sling like this? I get a mild chuff from some of my heavier braids, but nothing like the boom this one produces. I'm very interested in other's experiences!


...

I made this one with a tapered release cord. I always just called them rattails. No cracker on it at the moment, but I still get some decent cracks. Nothing compared to yours though. After watching that video I immediatley wanted to
try it with a cracker attached.
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Re: You guys are going to like this...
Reply #9 - Aug 4th, 2005 at 12:45am
 
Inspirational, Matthias.  I can't imagine having that baby in a valley and just letting it roar, with the flying stone to boot.  Very nice work, as always.
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Re: You guys are going to like this...
Reply #10 - Aug 4th, 2005 at 11:40am
 
I want one !
And I'm not alone :-) Which begs the question Matthias: How much ?

Funslinger, that slinging technique is the one I use. And from my point of view (ie: until finding this website a week or so ago assuming I was the only person left who'd ever used a sling) it's the natural way of using a sling, ie: the one I adopted without knowing there were traditional techniques.
The initial up and down swing gives the stone momentum and the sideways release gives you straight line accurate aiming. Plus you can walk around with the sling in the resting position and get a shot off accurately inside a couple of seconds without looking like a prat. (no offence meant to the people who hold their slings above their heads first  and look daft :-)

But more importantly, How much Matthias ????
Yeah yeah I know I should make one myself. And I have just printed off the guide to making a simple braided sling. Getting round to making it (getting cord etc) could take months. Making one of those babies - well conservatively we're talking years :-)
So yes there's a market, name your price mate :-)
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« Last Edit: Aug 4th, 2005 at 2:28pm by Curious Aardvark »  

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Matthias
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Re: You guys are going to like this...
Reply #11 - Aug 5th, 2005 at 1:34pm
 
Anyone know what controls the pitch of the crack? It varies with the style of throw and how hard you sling, but is there a design characteristic of the sling/whip itself that biases it one way or another?

FS the style of throw I'm using is the one I came up with in my (pre-internet Smiley) early days. The only real difference might be that most of the "historical" styles start with you holding the rock? In the video you can see me pinching up a bit in the shoulders, which is pretty poor form - at this point I was still worried about lashing myself across the head/back/leg! I can develop about the same amount of power  with this throw as any other, and you can effectively use more body movement to add some extra grunt. I never have trouble with losing stones anymore, with any style (this one especially) and any shape rock. Not sure if this is something to do with practice, or the types of slings I normally use (shallow cord edged pouches)? Ammo shape seems to make little to no difference either.

Aardvark/Tint etc. - This is a pretty quick (relatively) sling to whip up, even with the tapered cover, which is by far the most work. I figure that I have about 5-6 hours in this one, including quite a bit of experimenting and running back and forth to the computer. I'm a bit surprised that there is not more info on whip-braiding on the net considering the number of people interested. Using a leather pouch cuts the time down quite a bit. As for selling things, well, I think my hourly rate puts sling-making out of reach. Happy to give lots of free advice though!

I'd love to see some more of these turning up. A couple of more data points would go a long way toward figuring out the best approach. The crack is a really cool effect, and certainly attracts attention. Even my jaded family and friends took notice right away:

Q: "How are you making that noise?"
A: (with pig in $%^ grin) "Speed of sound, man, whaPOWwww!!Grin"

Matthias
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Re: You guys are going to like this...
Reply #12 - Aug 5th, 2005 at 2:15pm
 
That there is a pretty cool slingwhip....I am really like that lead-core cord. I will be definately looking for some of that.
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Re: You guys are going to like this...
Reply #13 - Aug 6th, 2005 at 12:24am
 
Hey all you gotta do is put a 2 oz weight on the end of the retention cord just below the finger hole and it could be used as a flail too.Close combat AND projectile weapon too. Grin ah violence all around.
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Re: You guys are going to like this...
Reply #14 - Aug 6th, 2005 at 7:34am
 
So what's your hourly rate ?
Don't underestimate the amount of money idiots like me are prepared to spend on essentially useless toys Smiley
And as for toys that go BANG !
Well, lets just say at the moment in england to have something that goes bang and you can't be arrested for using, that's almost priceless Smiley

Plus the pound is worth many of your canadian dollars Smiley
Go on put a price on it - you know you want to Smiley
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Do All things with Honour and Generosity: Regret Nothing, Envy None, Apologise Seldom and Bow your head to No One  - works for me Smiley
 
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