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ZIP GUNS?? (Read 13917 times)
jonjon
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ZIP GUNS??
Jul 21st, 2004 at 1:34pm
 
Has anybody on this site made a zip gun before.
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Re: ZIP GUNS??
Reply #1 - Jul 22nd, 2004 at 1:17am
 
What is a Zip Gun? Do you have a picture.
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jonjon
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Re: ZIP GUNS??
Reply #2 - Jul 22nd, 2004 at 1:41am
 
A zip gun is a .22 cailber bullet made from a metal writing pen.  Or of any kind of pipe laying around. Made from prisoners and gangs. Very cheap but, dangerous
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Zorrro
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Re: ZIP GUNS??
Reply #3 - Jul 22nd, 2004 at 2:14am
 
....Rather a strong steel pipe.... otherwise it will explode  in your hands if the pipe can't hold the  pressure, just check how thick are .22  canon walls and what material are made, specially the zone where the round is placed to get fired (the chamber?).
zip guns are "pen like"  not just  made out of a pen
Besides they're ilegal in most countries.
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jonjon
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Re: ZIP GUNS??
Reply #4 - Jul 23rd, 2004 at 12:23am
 
Zorrro, do u know how to make them, if you do can you give me a set of plans, or just email me at jonathan_griffith420@hotmial.com.  Thanks.
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nwmanitou
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Re: ZIP GUNS??
Reply #5 - Jul 23rd, 2004 at 12:46am
 
Hey Jon Jon, you looking to end up in Jail? I'm sure the ATF will oblige. Not only is attempting to make a zip gun tremendously dangerous, depending on what state you live in (if you live in the USA), you may find yourself spending five years at club Fed. You had better look up the state and federal firearms laws where you live concerning the manufacturing of firearms. Trust me, I have a healthy firearms collection and I legally carry a concealed handgun  on a regular basis, you don't want to run afoul of firearms legislation. Zip guns are classified as handguns by the ATF and are pretty much worthless pieces of crap, hardly worth risking a run in with the law.

Unless you are an experienced gunsmith or are being supervised by an experienced gunsmith, I highly discourage you from experimenting with homemade guns. If you are looking for more info on the laws surounding your little project check out any of these firearms board. But don't be surprised if they give you the same answer I did:

http://www.thehighroad.org
http://www.glocktalk.com
http://www.thefiringline.com
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Re: ZIP GUNS??
Reply #6 - Jul 23rd, 2004 at 1:19am
 
Great advice NWmanitou.   I know whereof you speak.  Having jumped through hoops to obtain BATF approval for some earlier weapon designs I can personally attest to the veracity of your statements......playing with fire will burn the inexperienced.  Living in a non concealed carry state....one has to be more creative for self protection.....I pack a loaded sling.   If I am nefariously accosted  I will distract the prospective thug with my version of the Yo Yo trick: 'Rock the baby" and drop into a quick overhand release.  Contact anywhere on the torso will most assuredly make a lasting 'impression'.


lol?
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Zorrro
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Re: ZIP GUNS??
Reply #7 - Jul 23rd, 2004 at 2:48am
 
Jonjon
Nwmanitou gave great advice
Making firearms is a very serious stuff, not only is important the know how but also the materials and tools available.
Just to satisfy curiosity: zip guns are  fairly simple , basically its a chambered .22 cannon  and the trigger system screwed in the rear of the cannon. The trigger system  is a percussion pin with a spring.  To  cock the zip gun, percussion pin is retracted to a notch (sort of a bolt action) and  firing is made releasing  the pin. (ooops! no safe... who wants a safe if it's intended for killing your jail mates)
Rounds develop high pressure when fired, specially in the chamber and backwards, towards the trigger system wich in this guns are also the closing device of the chamber.
So a quality fireweapon steel, and huge deep grooves for the screw are a must. This implies you need expensive precission tools for working the steel.
Iv'e seen some real well done zipguns and they are bulky compaired with a pen. Besides zipguns are a poor firearm. cannon is too short to get full advantage of the round powder, no rifling, no safe, very slow reloading, no sights (very close range) and they're ILEGAL
If i would need a tiny firearm i would buy sort of a derringer or any other little reliable legal and safe handgun.
P.D. there are some zipgun plans around in anarchist stuff archives, but too often these instructions are unaccurate or unreal or just tales.... too bad when dealing with homemade explosives and weaponry.... read the disclaimer....  they won't give a damn if you blow your @$$ up, or end in jail.
 
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Re: ZIP GUNS??
Reply #8 - Jul 23rd, 2004 at 5:13am
 
Yeah, make some napalm instead. Cheesy



lol
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Re: ZIP GUNS??
Reply #9 - Jul 23rd, 2004 at 6:33am
 
I used to say, "Give me a pipe, some mach headfs and a rock, and I'll have a firearm, if I want it!" which is quite TRUE!  There are many good books on the safe construction of such weapons from publishers such as Paladin Press, and anything from repeating shotguns to pistol-like weapons can be built using gas pipe, or plumbing pipe.  The "trombone shotgun" is the simplest, but I wouldn't bother to build one even though I can (make of that whatever you will, because that's all I'm going to say about that!) if I have to.  HOWEVER:  Your sling, or similar improvised NON-firearm weapons are QUIETER, MORE ACCURATE with greater range, and are JUST AS DEADLY (and often MORE so!) than any zip gun.  They are less cumbersome, less conspicuous and more likely to get the job done without landing you in the hospital, jail or even the morgue.

Home made blackpowder rifles (see the Foxfire Book series) are more useful in a resistance or survival  situation than "zip guns", and the best ones were turned out in SOE/OSS (wellrod, liberator), CIA, KGB,MOSSAD (the infamous "bicycle pump" martyr-maker)  or other labs of serious government assassination bureaus, usually equipped with noise suppressors and primitive sighting systems.

Since their primary use in serious work is normally to kill an armed enemy and take his weapon and escape with it, these are NOT intended as primary weapons, or weapons of choice, but as last-ditch desperation tools.

I, personally, am NOT a fan of them.  A good slinger or archer with a metal bullet to launch, or better still, a PROPERLY equipped person with a modern firearm properly modified if neccessary by a government technician can do the job cleaner, quieter and better.
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Re: ZIP GUNS??
Reply #10 - Jul 23rd, 2004 at 9:12am
 
how are zip guns illiagal? I thought a person was allowed to make any gun as long as they were allowed to own one (you have to be over 21 to own a zip gun i would think). It is illegal to concel any weapon wether it be a zip gun or a big knife. Although if you live in new york or califiona it might be didferent.
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Re: ZIP GUNS??
Reply #11 - Jul 23rd, 2004 at 9:45am
 
I've got some experience with homemade powder, incendiaries, explosives, rockets and firearms, luckly i keep all my original parts, but have seen 3 friends of mine going to the hospital, one of them without his right hand and 2 others with severe  burning and some shrapnell on their bodies...
related to homemade firearms i've tried  to make sort of a  muzzle-loader cannon, with a wood srtucture to hold the cannon at proper angle fixed to the ground with 4 spikes,  just to set fuse on fire and run like hell. I have used as propellants ,homemade black powder, cloratite and nitrocellulose... cannon were heavy brass, bronze and iron pipes the hardest we could find, bores went from 7 to 20 mm aprox. and lenght were from 20 to 60 centimetres.
We've used several Ignition systems: a hole (chimney) heat transference and electric ignition, we experimented with different loads and projectiles...i can tell you no one of the cannons survived the 1st shot , and  projectiles went under 50 metres range. we found some schrapnell from exploded cannon 15 cms under the ground (happy not being close to it)  even if one of that cannons would survived experimentation stage i would'nt hold one of these homemade firearms with my own hands even if that were my last resort.
May be Mac Gyver can make a firearm with a pipe, matches and some chewing gum, but that's only a movie, not the real world.
i've been playing with all that stuff since i was 9 old till i was about 18 old... then i went into it again when my kids asked me  how to do those things (better play with them and teach them how to make it the less dangerous possible) Luckly once they learnt the stuff and made some  bangs and booms and a lot of fun and smoke, they quit.
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nwmanitou
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Re: ZIP GUNS??
Reply #12 - Jul 23rd, 2004 at 10:19am
 
Gun, new york and california have some of the strictest gun control laws in the nation. What I'm saying is that firearms laws vary drastically between states. It may be perfectly legal to own  a pengun in one state but it may be a felony in another. While I'm not completely all knowing about ATF rules, I do believe you can manufacture your own firearms without a license provided they aren't for commercial sale. The ATF doesn't like guns floating around with no serial numbers.  And as far as carrying a concealed weapon... yes it is legal, if you obtain a concealed weapons permit. Currently 34+ (still some pending the outcome of a few court cases) states are "Shall Issue." And two states, Vermont and Alaska, require no permit to carry concealed.

Here is a page about stinger/zip/pen guns, but again, unless you know what you are doing and have read the laws pertaining to YOUR particular state I emphatically advise that you don't mess around with a home made gun. Take a gunsmithing course or something then try it out, but don't do something like this without some training. I do small custom work on my firearms all the time, eventually I'm going to machine my own, probably a .50 cal. But before I do I plan to take a gunsmithing course and have an experienced gun fabricator there to oversee my work. If a pice of dirt in the barrel can cause a catastrophic failure, imagine what improper headspacing, or lack of case support could do?
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Zorrro
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Re: ZIP GUNS??
Reply #13 - Jul 23rd, 2004 at 10:46am
 
agreed Nwmanitou
Here in Spain (sort of NRA's hell) it's totally liegal making selling, buying carrying any kind of firearm that don't look like a firearm and the opposite too, a toy that looks like a true firearm.
Even slingshots with wrist support  are ilegal 
need a license to carry a knife over 4,4"
automatic knives and double edged knives are ilegal
but you can carry a katana  Grin
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Re: ZIP GUNS??
Reply #14 - Jul 23rd, 2004 at 12:43pm
 
nwmanitou, you are a machinists too. Me too. I would love to make a big fifty some day also. My dad keeps bugging me to make him one.
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