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General >> General Slinging Discussion >> Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
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Message started by wannabeslinger on Jan 15th, 2007 at 3:02am

Title: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by wannabeslinger on Jan 15th, 2007 at 3:02am
Hello, I was wondering if anyone could show me how to make a weaved sling split pouch or not

thanks  :)

http://img216.imageshack.us/img216/9154/weavegc1.png

Title: Re: how to make a weave sling
Post by bwanasimba on Jan 15th, 2007 at 1:09pm
I would like to see something on that also. Where did you find the photo?

Title: Re: how to make a weave sling
Post by Willeke on Jan 15th, 2007 at 4:01pm
There is a lot on this site already, I'll give you some links:
http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?board=1;action=display;num=1060609211 (reply 4)
http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?board=1;action=display;num=1073633453 (long texts and some info hidden therein.)
http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?board=1;action=display;num=1093816689;start=0 (follow the link to wampun wampist)
http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1093816689/15 (reply 22 has a sketch of how to make the conversion into the pouch.)
http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?board=1;action=display;num=1108791726;start=1 (explanations in words)
http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1153811117/8#8 (several different bits to follow)
http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1120598015 (again a lot of info.)

Hope this helps a bit, (it is likely too much.)

Willeke

Title: Re: how to make a weave sling
Post by Matthias on Jan 15th, 2007 at 4:10pm
Nice looking slings!

The trick with woven pockets is setting up the split and figuring out what to do with any extra strands that you might need. The ones in the Pic are "8" strand pouches, 4 in each side. It looks to me like some of those are dropped, or cut short as the pouch tapers, which is a little tougher to do well. A better alternative might be to just pair the cords and continue weaving.

----tapering part----
1 bundle of 8
2 bundles of 4
4 bundles of 2
----split pouch----
2 bands, 4 strands each
----repeat taper----

Barak Bruard has some very good instructions with lots and lots of pictures, about how to do this. This is for a much more complicated braided sling, but the pouch is similar.

The ones in the picture above look like they might be built on a loop of warp yarns.

Matthias

Title: Re: how to make a weave sling
Post by Matthias on Jan 15th, 2007 at 5:01pm
Amras' pictures in the wiki are probably the best ones we have - I'd forgotten about them :-[

http://www.slinging.org/wiki/index.php?title=Methods_of_making_Slings_%28Modern_and_Historical%29#Puruvian_Sling

Matthias

Title: Re: how to make a weave sling
Post by Matthias on Jan 15th, 2007 at 6:05pm
For those of you that might be interested in making these, here are some photos of a "looped warp" pouch I just made (looks like it takes about an hour)... All one strand (sometimes there is an extra carried along the out warp). ;)









These might be good for people who want adjustable cords, or like to use paracord but would like something a little different than the usual leather pouch. Also a very good way to practice up your pouch weaving before tackling a full-patterned braided cord (80% of the work?).

I think that there should be room to even out the taper a bit by stepping down one bundle at a time rather than doubling the strands each transition. Maybe something like:

8
4/4
3/1/1/3
2/1/1/1/1/2
1/1/1/1 - 1/1/1/1

Work just fine the way it is though!

Matthias

Title: Re: how to make a weave sling
Post by Dravonk on Jan 15th, 2007 at 6:11pm
Willeke and Matthias, thank you for the links! Now I just need to find the time to try this out. It looks like it takes a bit longer than the braided slings I made.

Edit: And thanks for the pictures. I just saw them after pressing the Post button.

Title: Re: how to make a weave sling
Post by bwanasimba on Jan 16th, 2007 at 9:21am
Thanks for all the links and the photos!!
Very helpful. I think I give it a try this weekend.

Title: Re: how to make a weave sling
Post by Dale on Jan 16th, 2007 at 1:32pm
This is why I love Slinging.org!  There is always something new to learn!  Matthias, I never thought of braiding the pouch separately from the cords.  I just assumed that the way Barak Bruard showed, in his web site, was the way to do it: braid the retained cord, switch to weaving for the pouch, then braid the release cord.  This would be very much faster to do.  And I can combine a woven pouch with nylon cords, or I could braid some cords separately and tie them to the pouch. Thank you!

Title: Re: how to make a weave sling
Post by Willeke on Jan 16th, 2007 at 4:15pm
You can also mix the two ways.
Braid with just 3 or 4 strings, add the pouch this way, using those 3 or 4 strings instead of a few of the loops, and braid the release again.
Thanks Matthias.

Willeke.

Title: Re: how to make a weave sling
Post by Matthias on Jan 16th, 2007 at 6:16pm
Yes - this one actually is a really good candidate for the "loops on a string" type of construction. Glad everyone approves.

I tried the tapered version I brought up above, and it works pretty nicely. I mostly remembered to take pictures this time, so here is a mini-article:

Matthias
Here is the simple loom and twine I'm using. Using a loop of twine instead of just a second peg for the warp (up and down strings ;)) makes it a bit easier to manoever, and you can slacken the warp if it gets too tight. The twine is #18 nylon, and this particular stuff has a slightly sticky coating. Mason twine etc would be suitable, or sisal, braided fishing line, wool...
You need to leave yourself enough twine to do the loops AND all the back and forth weaving (the weft). A good estimate would probably be 5 times the length of the pouch, times the number of warp strands. For this 8"(20cm) pouch, I used about 6.5m, but I ran a tiny bit short and had to compensate - the formula would give you 8m(320"). It's much easier to cut off some extra at the end than to add more!

Find the middle of the long twine, and fold that around the hook/peg at one end. Now using both strands, make two loops each. You should end up with 4 loops, giving you eight warp strands, as well as two weft strands at the top of the work.
We're going to carry one of those strands down the side of the pouch until we need it at the split. This does make that side a little thicker, but not enough to worry about. If you *really* want everything symmetric the best I can suggest is to add a dummy cord to the other side to match. You could cut this flush when you're done with it - no need to tie it in as the binding will be more than adequate.

Work the other weft strand back and forth, making little figure-eights around the two bundles of warp - 4 on one side, 5 on the other. The key to a good looking weave is to not try to tension the weft at all. The type of weaving we are aiming for is called "weft faced" - when it is done you can't see the warp, the weft strands compact to form an even surface. This type of weaving doesn't have the "basketweave" look that say a placemat might have. It works well for slings because it's tidy. wider than normal, and the load-carrying warp strands are protected from wear.
After an appropriate numer of passes  (8 of so - count the "bumps" on one side) increase the width of the weave by dividing the bundles into 4/1/1/3 (remember that extra one - but try to ignore it). You'll have a bit of a funny transition here, but you can figure it out! You'll notice so far that all of the wraps on each side go the same direction... when we add a strand it upsets the rythm a bit and you'll probably end up with a double row, where the strand you are working with follows the same pattern as before. You can avoid this by switching to the new 3/1 pattern just before you finish the last row, rather than waiting until after. The weft will wrap the opposite direction at the edges, and there might be a little gap, but this way will give you a smoother surface... Try it both ways! You can always back up...
This is the trick to getting a nice tight surface. Weave in the weft relatively slack, and then push it up into the work every pass or so. I'm about to increase again to 3/1/1/1/1/2. The transitions in the body of the pouch were made after 4 back-and-forths, but you could alter the taper to suit the legth of the pouch you are making!
2/1/1/1/1/1/1/1 - 4 rows of this, and then we are ready to split the pouch. Finish with your working strand on the opposite side to the edge with the extra warp.
Aha! Now we have two strands to work with - one for each side of the pouch. The next part is easy, just go back and forth using only the 4 strands on one side until the length looks about right.
Same with the other side!
Joining is easy - just tuck your original weft strand into the edge (don't remember which one it is? Hint: It's the shorter one! ;)). Use the other weft strand to work 4 rows of back and forth over all 8 strands.
Taper the pouch down using the same schedule as the beginning. For some reason this seems easier, but you'll have to figure out the best way to approach each change again to avoid double rows.

Once you get down to the 2-bundle stage, lay an extra loop of twine along the edge that doesn't have the extra warp in it (the thinner one), continue weaving, covering that loop as well. We'll use it at the end to pull the tail of the last bit of twine back into the weaving, making a nice strong and tidy finish.
Almost done! Pull the tail through (you might have to pull pretty hard)
Snip the two tails flush with the surface and you're done! Nice Work! 8-)
Woven split pouches hold rocks very well. The extra width and stiffness makes them easier to handle than braided pockets, and the shape is as good or better than most simple leather pouches. Tie on some bootlaces or braid up some custom cords and go slinging! Maybe next time we'll figure out those fancy-looking peruvian braids?

Title: Re: how to make a weave sling
Post by bwanasimba on Jan 16th, 2007 at 6:26pm
Most excellent post Matthias!!!!


Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by Taiki on Jan 22nd, 2007 at 1:06pm
thx Matthias that should keep me busy for a few hours i think ;D

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by Dale on Jan 22nd, 2007 at 4:50pm
Matthias,

I built me a rig like yours from a pine board and two cup hooks.  I'm about a third of the way through weaving a pouch.  I am not, of course, getting as clean an appearance as you do, which I attribute to lack of experience.  However, I notice some differences between my setup and your pictures, so I have a question.

You instructed us not to put any tension on the weft, as we work, and I have been leaving that loose (just packing the threads down as I work, with my fingers or a small nail).  However, I did put some tension on the warp before I started.  It appears from your photos, that you did not; the warp threads are rather loose.  Would tensioning the warp threads, cause me any problems?  Would starting over with the warp looser, help?  (OK, I guess that's two questions...)

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by Willeke on Jan 22nd, 2007 at 5:03pm
Dale,
I have not worked with this rig, but I have woven a fair bit.
(And you never know when Matthias will be in next.)

You need a little tension on the warp. It will still work when there is a lot of tension, but when there is no tension it is very hard working.

One way of tensioning is just pressing down the warp when you packing down the weft, which is when you need that tension most.

Willeke

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by Matthias on Jan 22nd, 2007 at 6:32pm

Willeke wrote on Jan 22nd, 2007 at 5:03pm:
(And you never know when Matthias will be in next.)


HEY! I'm here right now! ;D

It does look looser in the pictures than I remember it being... Normally, for a weft-faced weave you'd want the warp pretty tight, but that does make it a little tricky to work with, and the tapers might be tougher to balance out. Like Willeke suggests, what I did is pull up and back to tension the warp only when I was packing in the next row of weft, which I ended up doing after every insertion. The already-woven sections are almost rigid - they don't need any support.

I'm relying on the packing of the weft for almost all of the structure here. For the first pocket I posted, I waited a few passes before compacting, and it shows in the uneven product. Maybe fingers aren't pokey enough to really settle the weave?

I'll try with some "dry" twine to see if there is any difference. The tack probably helps a bit?

Matthias

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by bigkahuna on Jan 22nd, 2007 at 8:51pm
Great job with this thread. As usual you guys make the difficult sounding task look easy, and actually make it easy for everyone. Thank you!

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by CanDo on Jan 24th, 2007 at 7:49pm
Matthias,
Get that Awesome post into the Articles ASAP! Excellent instructions well worth a spot there. Thanks :)

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by dork on Jan 25th, 2007 at 8:09pm
Thanks for the simple instructions. I never thought of weaving the pouch seperate then adding the cords. I have been making many attempts at woven pouches finding myself discouraged with how long it takes or not liking the results. Ihave one braided sling with the pouch woven into the cords. It took a lot of experimenting, and time to make it. But I love the the performance above all of my other slings. I don't know what it is but it has a much better feel to it, like you can almost feel the stone through the cords. Maybe its just me. Thanks anyway this will help a lot.  

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by big_sling_gland on Dec 20th, 2007 at 4:25pm
Ill try that for sure!
great work Matthias ;)

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by big_sling_gland on Dec 22nd, 2007 at 4:38pm
tryed it ... sucked

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by David Morningstar on Oct 6th, 2009 at 1:49pm

I'm bumping this thread because it is cool.  8-)

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by xxkid123 on Oct 6th, 2009 at 3:30pm
i would have made one if i knew how to weave like that :(. i can only weave rockmans

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by walter on Oct 7th, 2009 at 1:07pm
I've been trying to figure out how to make a woven split pouch (just a pouch) that you can attach cords to for a while now. Any old cords! I would never have figured it out. I think looped weaving is called bowes?

Thanks for the bump David.  

walter

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by slingingrat on Oct 7th, 2009 at 6:09pm
Iam sure thats a lot harder then he made it look but good info

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by Masiaka on Oct 7th, 2009 at 7:08pm
Sweet! Now I have to make one!

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by echelon7 on Oct 7th, 2009 at 7:55pm
i personally really like the king tut sling that timothy potter came up with.
http://slinging.org/index.php?page=a-method-for-reproducing-a-sling-found-in-the-tomb-of-tutankhamen---timothy-potter

made a few of them.  very nice.
Thanks Potter!

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by Knaight on Oct 7th, 2009 at 8:34pm
Yeah, that thing is seriously cool. Pretty easy to make too, although I'm not exactly sure on how to make whipping.

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by David Morningstar on Oct 7th, 2009 at 10:11pm

echelon7 wrote on Oct 7th, 2009 at 7:55pm:
i personally really like the king tut sling that timothy potter came up with.
http://slinging.org/index.php?page=a-method-for-reproducing-a-sling-found-in-the-tomb-of-tutankhamen---timothy-potter

made a few of them.  very nice.
Thanks Potter!


Wow! Any you have made of those, get us pics if you can! Remember that I am a short distance from an Egyptian original. The museum would be well impressed to see a reproduction..

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by Masiaka on Oct 8th, 2009 at 12:38am
I'm in the process of making a full size Tut. It's my 7th attempt, after 6 failures. It gets exponentially harder when you double the ammount of strands.

I did make one perfect one before this out of nylon mason line that was beautiful. The line was so slippery that it dropped rocks, golf balls, tennis balls, etc. Never managed to make it work.  :'(

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by xxkid123 on Oct 8th, 2009 at 3:56pm
i think someone made a tut sling with multiple colors- i think regular jute then a bit of died purple jute.

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by echelon7 on Oct 8th, 2009 at 9:39pm
my first actual accomplishment was done with hemp. it worked pretty well. i like it a lot. i sadly have not been able to use it yet and ive had it for weeks.  this was my first time using hemp. its a good material but slightly stiff.  i was thinking of make it next with that nylon mason line but idk now. its an awesome looking sling though.  fun to make.

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by walter on Oct 17th, 2009 at 6:06pm
Gave this loop pouch thing a try and found it a bit more difficult than just weaving a split pouch as you build the sling. Instead of going with the eight inches Matthias used, I tried six and when it was all over with, ended up with a 2 x 4.75" pouch. Most of my slings have that exact pouch length, but I was going for a longer one here.

I also had a hard time getting it symmetric and as you can see, did not succeed. I still think that making up a bunch of pouches might be a good idea. Nothing easier than attaching a couple of cords with a larkshead. Oh yeah, it took me four hours, not one. That could be the learning curve.  Anyway, the next one will be eight inches long and perfectly symmetrical - or you guys won't see it!

http://img5.glowfoto.com/images/2009/10/17-1428197516M.jpg Loop Pouch 1 Wool over cotton

walter

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by xxkid123 on Oct 18th, 2009 at 12:09pm
man, I'd be proud to have an asymmetrical one.

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by walter on Oct 24th, 2009 at 8:32pm
The same pouch with cords. I like braiding the cords from the pouch out. No finger loop to braid or weave!  

http://img5.glowfoto.com/images/2009/10/24-1705495961M.jpg

walter

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by xxkid123 on Oct 25th, 2009 at 1:11pm
nice, is the pouch restricting in any way? I'm used to my slits being adjustable like rockman slings, or pouches with a wide capability like Aussies

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by walter on Oct 25th, 2009 at 9:17pm
Not too much adjustment there. It's basically just a two inch gash. You can spread it a little, but not too much. Definately not like a Rockman or Aussie split pouch. Tried tennis balls, but lost a few on figure 8's. Lost one rock winding up for my helicopter, but i've also managed that with my other slings.

What I like about this sling is that it is light, fast and I hit more consistently with it than any other except for maybe my reverse twist paracord/leather pouch sling. Don't know why. Like it enough to build another one. This time i'm going to try a larger pouch. Like seven inches so i'll end up with a pouch a little over 6" overall.  

walter

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by Aussie on Mar 24th, 2010 at 5:31pm
Et cetera pointed out this old thread so now bringing this interesting sling design to the top. Unusual in that the pouch is made separately so if you make a mistake on the cord lengths not all your work is wasted. The link is also included in the FAQ now.

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by WOODSLORE on Mar 25th, 2010 at 1:38pm
AWSOME!!!!! I gotta try that one  ;D

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by Et Cetera on Mar 26th, 2010 at 9:41pm

Aussie wrote on Mar 24th, 2010 at 5:31pm:
Et cetera pointed out this old thread so now bringing this interesting sling design to the top. Unusual in that the pouch is made separately so if you make a mistake on the cord lengths not all your work is wasted. The link is also included in the FAQ now.

Is it in the guides and articles section?

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by Aussie on Mar 26th, 2010 at 9:59pm

Et Cetera wrote on Mar 26th, 2010 at 9:41pm:

Aussie wrote on Mar 24th, 2010 at 5:31pm:
Et cetera pointed out this old thread so now bringing this interesting sling design to the top. Unusual in that the pouch is made separately so if you make a mistake on the cord lengths not all your work is wasted. The link is also included in the FAQ now.

Is it in the guides and articles section?


Despite my almost superhuman powers as a moderator, putting something in the G&A Section is beyond even me. Also it must be in the form of an article not just a thread. You may of course, suggest it to Chris yourself.

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by Cervantes on Apr 13th, 2010 at 3:19pm
It sure does help to have so many knowledgeable;e people to draw upon for all those things we all want to try..
This blog is almost like a tribe with elders.. and I'm a scrub youth trying to make it in the world..

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by ishi on Jul 24th, 2010 at 10:20am
bump

been thinking about making a separate pouch myself
with maybe d-rings or keyring circles at the ends for quick change to different lengths

i'd like to make a pouch frame/support from a single length of paracord and then weave the paracord

just have to find the right pouch frame/support design

where's my scrap paper ?

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by xxkid123 on Jul 24th, 2010 at 12:41pm

ishi wrote on Jul 24th, 2010 at 10:20am:
bump

been thinking about making a separate pouch myself
with maybe d-rings or keyring circles at the ends for quick change to different lengths

i'd like to make a pouch frame/support from a single length of paracord and then weave the paracord

just have to find the right pouch frame/support design

where's my scrap paper ?


this already is made from one piece of cord, but not as thick as paracord. not sure if it will work. the method here has the cord looped into 3 large loops, then hooked up. the stray ends are hidden under the weave.

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by jocajo on Aug 26th, 2016 at 3:05pm
All links are dead


Please reupload

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by GurtTractor on Jul 7th, 2019 at 7:35am
Hello.

I've been experimenting with various sling designs, most of which have been based on tutorials here :)  This one is my favourite so far.

I really like the modular nature of this, as I only started slinging a month or so ago I'm still figuring out the ideal lengths for myself, so being able to reuse the pouch for various length cords and with different release and retention knot configurations makes a lot of sense. Plus if the release cord ever wears out it will be a doddle to replace.

Also I feel like it's possibly the ideal size and shape for accuracy with large or small stones. I started out with more deep shaped pouches, but I feel like these tend to hang on the stone a little more as it exits. The minimal wear pattern I've seen so far with this woven split pouch design seems to suggest that it's a particularly efficient one. No doubt I will be experimenting much more soon enough so I imagine my opinions will change again :P

Here is my latest pouch, the third of this design I've made so far. It is made with 1.3mm dyneema (UHMWPE fibre) with the release and retention cords being 1.8mm of the same material, which I was using for my previous two pouches. When I used the 1.8mm stuff I couldn't seem to manage the weft faced weave and ended up with just a basket weave, which is probably still fine for material of that size and density. For the 1.3mm cord pouch I managed to get the weft facing much better, not quite perfect but I should improve each time I make one. I'm considering getting another reel of the 1mm (I used my previous 31 metres for some previous slings, David Morningstar's Mexican woven pouch) as I'm aiming to get it as lightweight as possible as that seems to feel best to me, the 550 paracord slings I've made so far have felt really heavy and awkward.



I've mostly gone for the medium length of sling so far, thumb in retention loop with the start of the pouch coming to my shoulder (a way of measuring I got from Luis Pons Livermore in a short bit of documentary on youtube), but for this one I wanted to try something a bit longer, so it's going from my thumb in the loops with the middle of the pouch at the centre of my chest - 35 inches , which also happens to correspond to just under half my height. I've found this length to be one of my favourites so far, tons of power and still reasonably controllable. Firing stones over a small reservoir I'm doing over 150m pretty easily. I don't think I could make it that much longer though, I did try it from thumb to opposite shoulder once and that was quite unusable, but it's probably a case of finding the right technique.

The retention loops there is made with the fairly simple double figure 8 knot - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8n2w4SN5oF8 

The release knot is the "EStar stopper knot" - https://www.animatedknots.com/estar-stopper-knot But with an additional pass down and back up through near the thinnest side in order to even it out and make it a little thicker. I've found it necessary to have a knot that size when casting really large rocks, with a long sling once it gets up to near final speed the amount of pull it has is pretty intense, and dyneema can be a little slippery so a fat knot makes it much easier to hang onto.

Looking forward to trying out many more designs and materials! :)

Thanks very much to all those who've put together all these excellent guides and information.

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by Mersa on Jul 8th, 2019 at 12:07am
Nice , I love dyneema

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by cram on Jul 8th, 2019 at 7:08am
Nice!

Title: Re: Woven sling pockets - now with instructions!
Post by Kick on Jul 9th, 2019 at 9:52am
That looks awesome!

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