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General >> Project Goliath - The History of The Sling >> Egyptian sling
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Message started by funda_iucunda on Feb 26th, 2006 at 3:16pm

Title: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Feb 26th, 2006 at 3:16pm
Hallo fellow slingers,

this mail is my very first in this form. The Goliath project is very interesting. I didn't read the whole thread so far. Did you already discuss ancient Egyptian slings? Samples survived from Lahun (west of Nil river) and in the tomb of Tut Ench Amun. In the british Journal of the Arms and Armour Society 2.10 June 1958 (p. 226-230) is an article about the reconstruction: "An ancient Egyptian sling reconstructed". I desperately searched for libraries and book sellers disposing of this journal, but without any success. On the continent it sometimes seems very difficult to get british publications (with the exception of Harry Potter;-))).  I need information about the methods of construction of those surviving slings. The article "The Ballistics of The Sling" by Thom Richardson just mentions that there are reconstructions, but gave no detailled infomation. Who can help?



Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Matthias on Feb 26th, 2006 at 8:11pm
I have some very nice pictures that were sent to me by forum member Gaius_Cornelius quite a while ago, but I'll have to dig up my archives to track them down... Even with large high-res images, the construction is hard to sort out. The reconstruction doesn't appear to have been constructed in an identical manner - the shape and overall look is right, but the detail in the weave (?) may not be.

Matthias

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by bigkahuna on Mar 2nd, 2006 at 12:41am
If you look in our "Members Gallery" you will see two nice replicas of the Egyptian sling. One is by a fellow named Paul and the other is by a Graham Cole. They both did nice jobs judging by their pictures. :)

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Mar 3rd, 2006 at 4:14pm
Many thanks for your information. Especially the photos of the sling of Graham Cole look very convincing. But it is difficult to judge about the exact way of braiding. The originals are made from flax. The manner seems rather complicated with cords braided of 10 strings. The loop is made of a 5 strings cord of which the ends coming together create the 10 strings cord. The pouch seems to be for me the most complicated part. It seems to be woven by using the 10 strings as warp (5 on each side). In the center seem to be additional strings woven in. For that I have no idea. Richardson points out that the making reminds on recent peruvian slings. But the peruvian sling I have seems to be different. Its strings are much tighter and thicker so the structure of the pouch is rather lengthwise. The egyptian sling pouch is rather crosswise structured. May be that these difference is caused by differnt relations of thickness of the warp and the filling.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Willeke on Mar 4th, 2006 at 7:19am
I had an othere look at the Egyptian sling and its remake as shown in these photos:




I get the impression that in the remake the extra warp is brought in at the outside, maybe the pouch is made first and the string is added afterwards. The tool with the thread on it gives the impression that what would be the warp, the threads from the string, is the weft in this way of working.
In the old version I do not get that impression and it seems that the extra warp needed are added and taken away along the line I made red in his sketch.

If you use a simple loom, like a backstrap loom or cardweaving, this is easy to do.
That way of working allows you to start working on one end of the string, like in the finger loop, to continue till the other end of the sling, adding threads and taking them away when needed.

May I repeat that all I have to go on are these 2 photos, so it is not really much in the way of evidence.

Willeke

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Gaius_Cornelius on Mar 16th, 2006 at 3:34pm
Perhaps I can clarify a few things.

Firstly, Graham Cole and Gaius Cornelius are one and the same person - myself. The photographs refered to were taken by me, but the reconstruction is that of E. Martin Burgess.

The paper that you need to see is an article in Journal of the Arms and Armour Society, Voll II, No 10, June 1958, pp226-230: An Ancient Egyptian Sling Reconstructed, E Martin Burgess.

Burgess goes into considerable detail regarding how he reconstructed the sling.

Having had a good look at both the original and the Burgess reconstruction I would have to say that Burgess got it right in every detail.

I have attempted my own reconstruction, but I never finished it. The cords are a 10 strand eliptical sinnet (Burgess calls it a square sinnet, but that is not strictly correct), that is fairly straightforward, but I could not get an attractive looking finger loop even after several attempts.

In case any one is wondering, the loom in the photos was made by Burgess and is speculative.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Willeke on Mar 16th, 2006 at 4:41pm
Thanks for explaning.
As you have seen the origional and had a good look at the reconstruction, your oppinion is much better than mine, based as it is on a photo.

It will be hard, for me, to get hold of the article mentioned, because I do not have access to a library where they keep magazines like that.

Willeke

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by SlingWolf on Mar 19th, 2006 at 7:12pm
Where did u find that sling?

;D SlingWolf ;D

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Gaius_Cornelius on Mar 21st, 2006 at 3:02am
The sling is in the Petrie Museum in University College London.

It is discussed in this article:

http://www.slinging.org/25.html

Also see:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sling_%28weapon%29

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Mar 21st, 2006 at 4:58pm
at Gaius Cornelius:

the article in the Journal of Arms and Armour seems to be a good source. Unfortunately I didn't manage to get a copy so far. May be this is such a special kind of literature which is quite seldom in german libraries.
In the www I found some information concerning the square sinnet but nothing about the elliptical sinnet. What's the difference? Is it just the fact that instead of 8 strands 10 are necessary which causes a rather elliptical or oval profile of the cord?

funda iucunda

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Gaius_Cornelius on Mar 24th, 2006 at 3:55pm
funda_iucunda: I have left a message for you in your inbox. Gaius Cornelius.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on May 17th, 2006 at 4:28pm
Gaius Cornelius,

many thanks for your information. Rethinking the material I'm not sure how thick the strands have to be. 1 mm is probably too thin, 3 mm seems very thick. If I put 10 strands in a cord I get a diameter of 3 respectively 4 cords. With each one being 3 mm the whole cords diameter would be 9 to 12 mm. The cord of the original sling is 6 to 7 mm thick.  With 2 mm flax it would be easier to get 7 mm diameter, I think.

Another question concerns the weaving of the strings into the pouch. Spliting up the strings into half means to have 40 half strings at once at a point of the pouch where it is still quite narrow. When it is possible to weave in 40 strings at each end of the pouch it must be diffficult to have enough half strings as a weft thread to cover the warp in the centre of the pouch where it is much wider. The pictures of the sling make the impression to me that in the centre of the original pouch additional strings have been worked into the warp. The diamond shaped cente of the pouch seems to differ in texture and colour to the surrounding borders of the pouch.

Just the day after reading Burgess' reconstruction of the egyptian sling I found an antiquarian edition of Ashley's Book of Knots in a small book store around the corner. So I feel well equipped for the start.

funda iucunda

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Aug 26th, 2006 at 5:25pm
After three months of silence on this mail thread comes my first attempt to reconstruct the ancient Egyptian sling of Lahun, Egypt. The method of my reconstruction is largely based on the description of Burgess (Journal of the Arms and Armour Society, Vol. II, No. 10, June 1958, pp. 226-230).



replica of the Lahun sling 2006 (match box for comparison)

For this first attempt I used an organic string made for tying up parcels. The biological origin is not known to me. The disadvantages of this material are obvious. But I wanted to start the work and gain experience instead of wasting more time in search for the optimal flax string. Officially the string I used has a diameter of 2 mm. But actually it varies between 1,5 and 3 mm. Even with 2 mm diameter the string is much too thick to reach the diameter of 7 mm the cords of the original sling have. It has a diameter betwenn 9 and 10 mm. This thickness and stiffness of the used material caused a stiffness of the sling that surely differs much from the original one. But the over all length and the size of the pouch are nearly identical to the original sling.

My reconstruction deviates a bit from Burgess’ method to make the retention loop. Burgess passed only the centre strings of the 9 plait through the little 5-plait loop. Inspired by my own interpretation of the pictures I passed all 9 strings through this little loop with the outcome that only the tenth string keeps the retention loop from tying up. After a second and closer comparison of photos and my reconstruction I now agree with Burgess.

The release cord of the original sling is not preserved. So there are different solutions possible. Burgess recommended that each cord is made separately. So it is not too unrealistic to make the release end according to the way of making the loop (of course considering the necessary differences). I started from the end by making first a small 5 string plait with a loop and then going on with a 10 string plait. So it is virtually similar to the retention cords end but without the big loop. The advantage of this solution is that you get a tough end that would nearly never split up. But on the other hand it is not possible to get a cord that is thinner at its end than next to the pouch.

The whole work on the replica took me at least 10 hours. Especially the pouch was very laborious. I used a frame like Burgess. But after all I’m not sure whether the Egyptians made it in this complicated way. I presume that the pouch may have been made by weaving with small plates in a way that the 10 strings of the cord would be weaved forming a diamond shaped frame that then would be filled by another string of similar material and size. From the pictures of the original sling I took the impression that the weft in the centre part of the pouch is made of another material than the edges.



pouch, loop and the end of the release cord (replica 2006)

Another issue is the fact that Burgess plated both cords from different strings. The cords are then worked from both ends into the weft of the pouch. Though I first doubted that such a pouch made of strings coming from two sides would be strong enough I changed my mind after using it. It is tough enough not to be torn off by frequent use. But it might come out to be more elegant to make the cords and the pouch of strings going straight through over the total length of the sling.

For throwing I used egg shaped stones of a weight of about 50 to 60 g. Though the range of the sling is limited by the rather short cords the stones flew with pretty much energy about 60 to 70 m far. A problem was the fact that especially heavier stones rolled from the pouch too early, because it’s flat. I think that for this reason stones of more than 100 g are not useful.

During my throws I got the impression that the sling with an optimal stone a little bit reminded me of the ancient reliefs showing Assyrian slingers in action. May be that the Lahun sling is founded on Asian models as I read somewhere in the literature. Korfmann found out that the sling was not an original Egyptian weapon but was adopted by the Egyptians after getting in contact with the Asian cultures of Ur, Babylonia Assyria and others. So is it possible to interpret the Lahun sling as being kindred to the depicted Assyrian slings?

My future plan is to make a sling of the original material, flax. I now dispose of a flax string of a diameter of 0,7 mm. If I twist it double a 10 string plate might come close to that original diameter. The pouch I want to weave with plates by splitting the double twisted strings in order to get the figure of eight weave Burgess writes about. This method would allow as well create a release cord that becomes thinner to its end by cutting half of each string when going on plaiting the cord.

funda iucunda

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by siguy on Aug 26th, 2006 at 6:38pm
wow.

that's some nice work, and some nice experience gained.

i wish you much luck in the future with your further efforts  

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by nightweave on Aug 26th, 2006 at 7:44pm
funda_iucunda,

Beautiful work, so I'll get striaght to my point. On your next effort would you be willing to take more photos. I have asked Willeke to do a write up for the wiki on the Egyptian sling. And seeing as you have completed one and have the paperwork, could you talk to her I would appreciate the both of you working on an instruction for the wiki.

Nightweave

PS it really is a great job you've done.




Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by bigkahuna on Aug 26th, 2006 at 10:19pm
Outstanding!!!! Really nice job on the sling.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Rebel on Aug 27th, 2006 at 6:58am
Really nice sling :).
I dont think I can make a sling that is this complicated :'(
I can make braided slings, but this type of sling looks way to complicated.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Aug 31st, 2006 at 3:09pm
Rebel,

the plaiting work was really difficult. But don't panic!

A great and nearly indispensable help for me was Ashley’s Book of Knots. There I found the necessary explanations of knots and plaits Burgess took for granted. I’ve a German translation of the American edition of 1944 which contains the original drawings of the knots with their numbers. Here they are:

the 5 string plait for the small loop where the cord is to be passed through for making the retention loop (Ashley no. 2983) which is originally a 7 string plait that I took as model and changed it into a 5 string plait by reducing the 4 strings on the left side to 3 and accordingly on the right side from 3 to 2,

the 9 string plait (Ashley no. 2985) which forms the beautiful ear of corn plait Burgess describes,

the 10 strings plait for both cords (Ashley no. 3010).

The pouch I wove on a frame similar to the one Burgess used. The figure of eight weave he mentions is relatively simple. The strings of the cords are split into two and form the warp. One of them is going up and the other down. But they do not only cross each others way on the level of the weft, but are as well twisted around each other like a rope.

If something does not work open the plait and start again. Once you will succeed. Just go for it! :)

funda iucunda


Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Willeke on Aug 31st, 2006 at 3:40pm
funda iucunda,
Your sling looks good.

But I wonder why you used the frame Burgess discribed.
Looking at the sling, and its papers, both a weaver friend and I reacted that there is an easier way.

Our idea is, start with the fingerloop as you have done now, but with threads long enough for both cords.
Braid as you have done till the start of the pouch, transfer your threads onto a simple small loom, a backstrap-loom or start a tablet weave for the pouch, add as many threads as you need to get the width of the pouch, in the second half of the pouch you take those threads away, maybe by using them in the weft.
At the end of the pouch you start braiding again till the end of the cord.

I would add the extra threads just inside the weave, not on the outher edge, and take them away on the same point.

I want to make a sling this way, but can not find the needed time. I even have the materials I need......

Willeke

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by SlingWolf on Aug 31st, 2006 at 11:53pm
Wow, that thing is great!

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Rebel on Sep 1st, 2006 at 9:43am
Hello funda_iucunda.
Thanks for the encouraging. :)
I will try and make a sling like yours when I got the time to do so.

Rune -The Reb-

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Sep 3rd, 2006 at 3:54pm
Willeke,

many thanks for this hint. May be that tablet weaving is the clue. As I read somewhere tablet weaving has been invented by the ancient Egyptians 4,500 years ago and that tey reached a high standard. So this technique is very likely to be used for sling pouches.
I do not have experience with tablet weaving. Is it possible to weave a pouch with tablets without the pouch being rolled up like a drying leave? I fear that the strands of the cord forming the weft would tend to go straight down. So it might be necessary to use Burgess' frame in order to keep the pouch plain and in shape.

funda iucunda

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Willeke on Sep 3rd, 2006 at 4:20pm
Take a look on the web for some back strap looms and tablet weaving, it is real simple to use both, and they combine very good.

With tablet weaving the strings do stay neatly in a horizontal row, and when you use a simple loom or a backstrap loom you can adjust tension as needed.

The frame seems alien to the kind of weaving they had then.

Willeke

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by joshskijam on Mar 14th, 2008 at 6:37pm
I would like to make one of these, but I still haven't been able to find anything that would explain it to me. Does somebody have that article mentioned?

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Monkeywjcr on Mar 15th, 2008 at 8:12pm
Can some one post a picture that I can copy off of?

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Mar 19th, 2008 at 9:49am
Someone cancelled my pictures! >:(

funda

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Matthias on Mar 19th, 2008 at 12:40pm
I think we just broke the links in the last forum upgrade. I'll find them and edit the post, and if that doesn't work I have backups....

I wonder how many threads this is going to have affected?  :(

Matthias

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by curious_aardvark on Mar 22nd, 2008 at 12:23pm
lol - Matthias strikes again :-)

He does mean well ;-)
But yeah I'd like to see the pics as well.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Mar 24th, 2008 at 5:11pm
When the pictures are finally lost I can try to send those I still have or make new. At the moment I am weaving a new sling in the same manner. Its just a question of time  ::) when I will be ready to post its fotos.

funda

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Apr 8th, 2008 at 12:56am
I think I have them on my harddrive as well. I am pretty much a pic junkie when it comes to slings.

Marc Adkins


funda_iucunda wrote on Mar 24th, 2008 at 5:11pm:
When the pictures are finally lost I can try to send those I still have or make new. At the moment I am weaving a new sling in the same manner. Its just a question of time  ::) when I will be ready to post its fotos.

funda


Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Apr 9th, 2008 at 4:27pm
wnkleried,

if you want to post them, just do it. That would be great. I'm very busy at the moment so it will take some time before I can come up again with my pics.

funda

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by kava fiend on Apr 9th, 2008 at 9:19pm

@ winkleried: I'm really interested to see how this sling is made, if it's not to much trouble, if you have the pics, could you post them?  that would be awsome dude.

cheers,

Kava.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Apr 9th, 2008 at 10:44pm
Let me see ifI can isolate them from all the pics that I have

What I may end up doing os posting everything I have on the petra sling.

Marc Adkins


funda_iucunda wrote on Apr 9th, 2008 at 4:27pm:
wnkleried,

if you want to post them, just do it. That would be great. I'm very busy at the moment so it will take some time before I can come up again with my pics.

funda


Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Aug 9th, 2008 at 9:50pm
Ok here are the Egyptian sling pics that I have. Again I apoligise for the size of them, I can't seem to get this laptop to resize them

Marc Adkins

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Aug 9th, 2008 at 9:51pm
Petra Sling
UC6921.jpg (11 KB | )

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Aug 9th, 2008 at 9:52pm
Second Shot I have the sling
museum2.jpg (8 KB | )

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Aug 9th, 2008 at 9:52pm
3rd shot I have of the Sling


museum3.jpg (9 KB | )

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Aug 9th, 2008 at 9:54pm
This on e I am thinking is a reproduction I have it labeled as Cole 1
cole1.jpg (14 KB | )

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Aug 9th, 2008 at 9:54pm
Cole 2
cole2.jpg (11 KB | )

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Aug 9th, 2008 at 9:54pm
Cole 3
cole3.jpg (9 KB | )

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Aug 9th, 2008 at 9:55pm
Cole 4
cole4.jpg (12 KB | )

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Aug 9th, 2008 at 9:55pm
I have this one listed as Paul 1
paul1.jpg (15 KB | )

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Aug 9th, 2008 at 9:56pm
Paul 3. I have no Idea about Paul 2


paul3.jpg (6 KB | )

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Aug 9th, 2008 at 9:57pm
The King Tut Sling
tutSling1.jpg (224 KB | )

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Aug 9th, 2008 at 9:57pm
Shot of the Tut Pouch
HondaTutankamon.jpg (5 KB | )

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Aug 9th, 2008 at 10:00pm
Funda,
I don't suppose that you have an electronic Version of this article????

Marc Adkins

[quote author=funda_iucunda link=1140984986/0#12 date=1156627501]After three months of silence on this mail thread comes my first attempt to reconstruct the ancient Egyptian sling of Lahun, Egypt. The method of my reconstruction is largely based on the description of Burgess (Journal of the Arms and Armour Society, Vol. II, No. 10, June 1958, pp. 226-230).


Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by David Morningstar on Aug 10th, 2008 at 11:52am
An Egyptian sling in a museum a few miles from me, I will be going to see it when I get a free day...

http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1172017416/270#270


Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Aug 10th, 2008 at 1:21pm
Yep that's the Petra Lahun Sling. Lets us know when ya see it.

Marc Adkins


David Morningstar wrote on Aug 10th, 2008 at 11:52am:
An Egyptian sling in a museum a few miles from me, I will be going to see it when I get a free day...

http://slinging.org/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1172017416/270#270


Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by kava fiend on Aug 11th, 2008 at 5:32am
I came across this info about the Egyptian sling, the abstract would appear to be of interest.

Conservation Information Network (BCIN)
 
Author: Burgess, E. Martin
Title Article/Chapter: "An ancient Egyptian sling reconstructed"
Title of Source: J. Arms and Armour Society
AATA Number: 2-2034
Volume Number: 2
Date of Publication: 1958
Page Numbers: 226-230

Abstract: In the Flinders Petrie Collection at University College, London there is a sling of plaited string in fragile state dated c. 800 B.C. The article describes a reconstruction in new string and explains how all the original plaits were made. Basically the sling was a diamond shaped pouch with cords at each end.
The pouch was woven on a frame, the warps being double strings looped over pegs and the wefts being the split ends of the 20 strings in the two cords. The cords are each 22 inches long and are 10 part "square sennits". One cord tapers at the end and the other has a finger loop in the form of a 9 plait strap joined into a loop by passing some of the 9 strings through a small 5 plait loop at the end of the 9 plait where the 10 part sq. sennit starts.
The reconstruction looked exactly like the original and would throw stones up to 100 yards without skill. All techniques are fully described, and the stages of production illustrated. -- AATA

Originating Institution: AATA
Record Type: Abstract
Literature Type: Serial
Bibliographic Level: Analytic
Old BCIN Number: 106109
BCIN Number: 66315

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Aug 27th, 2008 at 5:52pm
David Morningstar,

a nearly 4000 year old sling! That is incredible! Do you have more information on and pictures of that? Is that the original sling or a replica? Is the kind of fiber known or the material of the sling shots? How long is the sling in total and in detail? It wozuld be fascinating to try to make a replica.
Until now I only knew the sling of Tut Anch Amun (1300 B.C.) and of Lahun (900 B.C.). Another sling was found in Switzerland of the Latène period (about 900 B.C.).

winkelried,

it seems to me that the sling David Morningstar shows is not the Lahun sling of 800 or 900 B.C. It looks significantly different to me. As far as I know there hadn't been found any sling shots with the Lahun sling.

funda iucunda

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Aug 27th, 2008 at 8:29pm
Funda check out the style of the sling and the caption that goes with it.

Site:  Africa, Egypt, Faiyum, Kahun (el-Lahun)

the (el-Lahun) is what is leading to belive that this is the same sling, along with the diamond shaped pouch ( although folded in half) and the weaving.

So in short it looks like the same bleeping sling, although the pics I do have of the Lahun sling are low quality ( basicly copies of copies) So I can't tell on the thogs attached to the pouch
The stones could have been added by one of the museam staff for the display



funda_iucunda wrote on Aug 27th, 2008 at 5:52pm:
David Morningstar,

a nearly 4000 year old sling! That is incredible! Do you have more information on and pictures of that? Is that the original sling or a replica? Is the kind of fiber known or the material of the sling shots? How long is the sling in total and in detail? It wozuld be fascinating to try to make a replica.
Until now I only knew the sling of Tut Anch Amun (1300 B.C.) and of Lahun (900 B.C.). Another sling was found in Switzerland of the Latène period (about 900 B.C.).

winkelried,

it seems to me that the sling David Morningstar shows is not the Lahun sling of 800 or 900 B.C. It looks significantly different to me. As far as I know there hadn't been found any sling shots with the Lahun sling.

funda iucunda


Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by David Morningstar on Aug 28th, 2008 at 6:29pm

winkleried wrote on Aug 27th, 2008 at 8:29pm:
So in short it looks like the same bleeping sling, although the pics I do have of the Lahun sling are low quality ( basicly copies of copies) So I can't tell on the thogs attached to the pouch



Googled with 'sling lahun petrie'. The upper one is a reproduction, the lower broken one is the original.



[Post edited to make it sound less arsey, sorry about that!]

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by David Morningstar on Aug 30th, 2008 at 1:50pm
I have seen the sling! I made a flying visit this morning and took some photos but I wont be able to post them till tomorrow cos I'm with my folks now and didnt bring my camera cable with me. Muppet!

Anyway the first thing to report is that its tiny, and so is the ammo. I doubt I'd be able to get my finger through the retention loop.

The cords look surprisingly lo-tech and scruffy compared to the very neat work of the pouch. I'm speculating wildly here, but could it be they are not the original cords? Was it originally a bigger sling with braided cords that broke and was re-strung and handed down for a child to use?

There is a large collection of all sorts of items from Lahun in Manchester. Lots of textile and corded items have survived astonishingly well. I'll go back again when I have time to do the place justice.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Aug 30th, 2008 at 5:08pm
David Morningstar,

many thanks for the quick report. I couldn't wait for hearing of it and I'm curious to read about your next visit. May be there is a report available with details and circumstances of the excavation or measures of the sling.

winkleried,

the pouch is in deed very similar to the "Petrie's sling" but the cord is very simple, just two or three twisted strings instead of 10 strings square sinnet which much more fits to the accuratness of the pouch. So I think that David has a point to assume that the cords might not be the originals.
What is surprising to me is, that obviously both slings are from the same place. Was this site used for 1000 years or might there be an uncertainty in fixing the age of the artifacts?

funda

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by David Morningstar on Aug 30th, 2008 at 6:07pm
The site was a pyramid construction area http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/El-Lahun

The museum is confident in its dating. Many of the other objects were dated to the same period. Petrie is mentioned in the Manchester Museum so it seems he is responsible for discovering both slings at the same site and dating them to different periods.

I will be able to find out more when I spend more time there soon. If you have a shopping list of questions I can try and get answers for you.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Aug 30th, 2008 at 6:39pm
I would suspect that the cords are not the originals, It could be they are old reproductions. Basicly not authentic but still antiques.

Museums were not always the models of conservation that they are today.

Marc Adkins


David Morningstar wrote on Aug 30th, 2008 at 1:50pm:
I have seen the sling! I made a flying visit this morning and took some photos but I wont be able to post them till tomorrow cos I'm with my folks now and didnt bring my camera cable with me. Muppet!

Anyway the first thing to report is that its tiny, and so is the ammo. I doubt I'd be able to get my finger through the retention loop.

The cords look surprisingly lo-tech and scruffy compared to the very neat work of the pouch. I'm speculating wildly here, but could it be they are not the original cords? Was it originally a bigger sling with braided cords that broke and was re-strung and handed down for a child to use?

There is a large collection of all sorts of items from Lahun in Manchester. Lots of textile and corded items have survived astonishingly well. I'll go back again when I have time to do the place justice.


Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Aug 30th, 2008 at 6:43pm
Ok
So we now have evidence of the same sling pattern being conserved for almost 1000 years if the date is accurate. I have no idea how they dated it but I would think they could get it with in a hundred years or so.

Marc Adkins


funda_iucunda wrote on Aug 30th, 2008 at 5:08pm:
winkleried,

the pouch is in deed very similar to the "Petrie's sling" but the cord is very simple, just two or three twisted strings instead of 10 strings square sinnet which much more fits to the accuratness of the pouch. So I think that David has a point to assume that the cords might not be the originals.
What is surprising to me is, that obviously both slings are from the same place. Was this site used for 1000 years or might there be an uncertainty in fixing the age of the artifacts?

funda


Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by David Morningstar on Aug 31st, 2008 at 6:02pm
Apologies for the poor light, the whole gallery is very dark and the exhibits have only dim lighting. Scroll down the picture to see the captions.

I can send you the original shots if you want them, 3072x2304 pixels and 3 Mb each.

Lahun_sling_01.jpg (78 KB | )

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by David Morningstar on Aug 31st, 2008 at 6:03pm
The pouch in more detail
Lahun_sling_02.jpg (83 KB | )

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by David Morningstar on Aug 31st, 2008 at 6:03pm
The tiny finger loop
Lahun_sling_03.jpg (71 KB | )

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Sep 1st, 2008 at 4:09pm
David,

great pictures! The pouch is really tiny. Is it possible that the material somehow shrinked? The cord and the pouch seem to have a coloured pattern as if strings of different colour have been used. Is this correct or just an illusion caused by camera light?

My shopping list is the following:

length of the release cord
length of the retention cord
thickness of the cords
material of the sling
length and width of the pouch
literature about this sling

Many thanks for your endeavour!

funda iucunda

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by David Morningstar on Sep 6th, 2008 at 3:47am
I meant to reply to this earlier, sorry! Yes, the cord does show two different colours in its twist. This is quite noticeable. I can try an take some pics with an object for scale, but it is several inches behind glass so this wont be perfect. I can ask the museum for more information if they have it but so far everything I know is with the first pic I posted in the pictures thread.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Sep 26th, 2008 at 4:02pm
Here comes according to my promise of march 24th the new sling. It is made in the same way as my first one but I used real flax which is the original material of the slings from Lahun.
(Somewhere I got several hundred meters of 1mm flax string which is normally used in the kitchen for making "Roulade". That is thin meat with mmuch salt and pepper and then rolled around a cucumber. The flax is used for fixing this meal for synthetic fibers would not stand being baked in a pan.)
The strings of this sling are slightly thinner than the original younger Lahun sling (9th cent. B.C.) but the other measures are close to the original. When making the pouch I had much tension on the weft. Therefor the pouch is formed like a flat mould. I didn't itend this but afterwards I saw on Davids fotos of the older Lahun sling a similar pattern of the pouch. The advantage of this mould is that round amunition would not easily fall out of it. The disadvantage seems to be that the projectiles dont leave the pouch as smoothly as they should. This is at least my impression .
Additional fotos will follow.

Funda iucunda




Schleuderreplika-Lahun-Sept_2008.png (1009 KB | )

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by David Morningstar on Sep 26th, 2008 at 7:41pm
Tidy work! Any chance you can punt me a hi-res version of that picture?

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Sep 27th, 2008 at 4:52pm
I made some more pictures and hope that they will be better.

funda

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by wanderer on Sep 28th, 2008 at 5:40am
Funda,

That looks a beautiful piece of work. Very nice.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Nov 18th, 2008 at 3:53pm
Here comes another picture of my sling replica (which does not seem to be really better then the previous :'()
and a picture showing the tool on which I braided the flax sling. It is shaped according to the article of Burgess. The role of flax is the material I used. I took i twice to get a strand which I then could open up again into two minor strings as Burgess recommends.

funda iucunda
Sling_replica_tools_2008.png (746 KB | )

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Nov 18th, 2008 at 3:55pm
This picture belongs to my mail above.

funda
sling_replica_Lahun_2008.png (985 KB | )

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Nov 18th, 2008 at 8:55pm
Looks Nice Funda,
Hoping I get off the road long enough to try weaving my own.

Marc


funda_iucunda wrote on Nov 18th, 2008 at 3:55pm:
This picture belongs to my mail above.

funda


Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Hondero on Jan 27th, 2009 at 11:33am

David Morningstar wrote on Sep 6th, 2008 at 3:47am:
I can try an take some pics with an object for scale, but it is several inches behind glass so this wont be perfect. I can ask the museum for more information if they have it but so far everything I know is with the first pic I posted in the pictures thread.



Since I have been absent of the forums some time I had not seen this topic, that is most interesting. Have you got more information from the museum? I think I´ll inquest what I can on the subject. I have a lot of questions:

- Why has not been disclosed this sling as much as the one of Petrie museum, being it better preserved and much more old?

- It could be that the dating is confused because Kahun was a town of the pyramid workers around the year 1900 b. C. that was left once the pyramide was concluded. The dating of Petrie sling could be mistaken and also corresponds to XX century b.C.

- Being foreign great part of the pyramid workers, corresponds the two slings to a non Egyptian culture?

This subject requires a research in depth, is not habitual to look at a sling of 4,000 years of antiquity. The truth is that it is too much well conserved in comparison with those of Tutan and Petrie museum.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by David Morningstar on Jan 27th, 2009 at 2:26pm

Hondero wrote on Jan 27th, 2009 at 11:33am:

David Morningstar wrote on Sep 6th, 2008 at 3:47am:
I can try an take some pics with an object for scale, but it is several inches behind glass so this wont be perfect. I can ask the museum for more information if they have it but so far everything I know is with the first pic I posted in the pictures thread.



Since I have been absent of the forums some time I had not seen this topic, that is most interesting. Have you got more information from the museum? I think I´ll inquest what I can on the subject. I have a lot of questions:

- Why has not been disclosed this sling as much as the one of Petrie museum, being it better preserved and much more old?


Because its not in London.


Quote:
- It could be that the dating is confused because Kahun was a town of the pyramid workers around the year 1900 b. C. that was left once the pyramide was concluded. The dating of Petrie sling could be mistaken and also corresponds to XX century b.C.

- Being foreign great part of the pyramid workers, corresponds the two slings to a non Egyptian culture?

This subject requires a research in depth, is not habitual to look at a sling of 4,000 years of antiquity. The truth is that it is too much well conserved in comparison with those of Tutan and Petrie museum.


The sling is only one item in a huge display of equally well preserved items including cloth, leather, cordage and other perishable materials.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Hondero on Feb 3rd, 2009 at 3:09pm
I´ve made some investigations on the two slings of Lahun. The dating of both are debatable and it does not seems that dating with C-14 have been made. In addition, they appear in secondary archaeological deposits, removed by reusability of the tombs or sacking of them, both things very frequent in Egypt. The Petrie sling was dated by himself subjectively since it appeared in a heap of rests along an iron spear point, that evidently do not belongs to the bronze age of XII dynasty when the pyramid of al-Lahun was constructed. For that reason Petrie dated the sling towards the 800 b.C., approximately in the iron age.
As far as the sling of the Manchester museum, it is mentioned in a publication of the British School of Archaeology in Egypt, in 1920, titled Lahun I, the Treasure, by Guy Brunton, who collaborated  in the excavation of Flinder Petrie. This is the paragraph where he mentions the sling:

8, with its rope sling, is doubtful;
it can hardly be Middle Kingdom with the curious
little projection at the bottom, and with the rope
so well preserved. A late date, probably Roman,
seems to be indicated.

Really, the label of the Manchester museum does not say restrictively of the antiquity of the sling but of the one of the archaeological site of Lahun. Perhaps some of our braiding experts can find differences in the fabric of both slings. For me, Petrie sling seems to be more primitive, although better woven. Its cradle seems flat, whereas the one of the Manchester is  a little dished, more technical and adapted to hold the small projectiles found with the sling.


Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Feb 7th, 2009 at 3:44pm
Hondero,

the dished shape of the manchester sling pouch is really striking. The other sling pouch seems to be flat, though the technique of making seems to me to be the same. A possible explanation of the concave profile might be the power you use to weave it. I made two replika of the Lahun II sling. Making the second I pulled the weft with much more power than at my first sling replika. The result is a dished shape. My first sling pouch is flat. Unfortunately it is not very well visble on my fotos above.

funda iucunda

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by ElliotB on Mar 2nd, 2009 at 4:59am
Funda:
I've made one of the tools shown above, but how do I go about weaving the actual pouch?

Elliot

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Mar 3rd, 2009 at 3:37pm
Elliot,

the method is shown in: E. Martin Burgess, An Ancient Egyptian Sling Reconstructed, Journal of the Arms and Armour Society, Voll II, No 10, June 1958, pp 226-230.

funda iucunda

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by ElliotB on Mar 4th, 2009 at 4:12am

funda_iucunda wrote on Mar 3rd, 2009 at 3:37pm:
Elliot,

the method is shown in: E. Martin Burgess, An Ancient Egyptian Sling Reconstructed, Journal of the Arms and Armour Society, Voll II, No 10, June 1958, pp 226-230.

funda iucunda


And where can I find that?  ;D

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by B.cereus on Mar 8th, 2009 at 11:49pm
nice replica, funda_iucunda ;D
is there any way where we can see each step of the consruction?

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Mar 12th, 2009 at 5:37pm
Cereus,

yes, doing it is the way I saw it  8-)

funda

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Mar 28th, 2009 at 4:36pm
Cereus,

many have already asked how to make the sling. i am currently working on a description of the making which I would like to add to the articles at slingign.org. It just will take a little bit time.

funda iucunda

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Thearos on Mar 30th, 2009 at 10:16pm
Please teach us ! Thanks to this site, I can braid cords and a split pouch, I can sew a horrible looking pouch on to the split ends and make the ugliest looking sling on earth-- but would love to have a Lahun style sling.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by David Morningstar on Apr 7th, 2009 at 9:04am
This is interesting, it describes and shows *two* slings from Tut's tomb...

http://www.griffith.ox.ac.uk/gri/carter/585y-p1324.html

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Apr 8th, 2009 at 2:20pm
Yes, Tut's sling is very interesting! We have a couple of pictures of it on the slinging org site, but unfortunately there are no descriptions of making, material or measures of it. It would be great to try a reconstruction!

funda iucunda

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by David Morningstar on Apr 8th, 2009 at 2:30pm
Look again - there are two different slings there.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on Apr 11th, 2009 at 4:05am
Yes, seem to be two slingpouches and several pieces of one or more cords. Has there ever been made an attempt to devide these entangled cords? That might lead to an idea which cords belonged to which pouch and how long they had once been.

funda

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Timothy Potter on Apr 23rd, 2009 at 1:10am
Last summer, I attempted a reconstruction of one of the slings from Tutankhamen's tomb. From studying the photograph, it seemed to me that the pouch of the sling on the right was woven in a formed shape, and wouldn't fold flat. It took several experiments to find a way of making that shape of pouch, but I found that with a triangular loom, warped on both sides, I could make at least a similar looking pouch. As to the cords, the photograph isn't very clear, but it looked to me like the thicker cords were a 4-strand round braid. Even though the thick cords belong to the sling on the left, I went ahead and used the 4-strand braid for my copy. Here is a picture of it:
tutsling1.jpg (Attachment deleted)

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by David Morningstar on Apr 23rd, 2009 at 3:14am

Wow, thats fabulous!

I will be at the Museum again later today, hopefully I will be able to get more pics of the Lahun sling.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by David Morningstar on Apr 23rd, 2009 at 5:35pm
Okay, we have more pics from the museum. Not a lot different from the last lot of pics I took, but I think the lighting is a bit better now.











Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Thearos on Apr 23rd, 2009 at 5:38pm
Could it be a wrist loop rather than a finger loop, as the label has it ?

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by David Morningstar on Apr 23rd, 2009 at 6:19pm
An interesting train of thought. As a finger loop it is tiny. I doubt I could get my finger through it. What it could be for is for pushing a bight through and using that as a finger noose, like C_A does.

I dont see any need for it to be used as a wrist loop, since the cords are not long and the pouch is quite small. Its not a big sling by any means, I would guesstimate 28" or so.

I'll be back there next Thursday so if you have any questions or pic requests, let me know. I can also email out the full-resolution pics if you want.



Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Thearos on Apr 23rd, 2009 at 7:14pm
Oh right. I thought the coil on the right was a big wrist loop, but I suppose the finger loop appears on the left, in fact. Sorry

Nice pics !

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by wanderer on Apr 24th, 2009 at 8:02am
Timothy -

That is beautiful work. If slings were not made that way, they should have been!

Could you explain a little about the triangular loom? I'm not clear how that all works.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Timothy Potter on Apr 25th, 2009 at 11:22pm

wanderer wrote on Apr 24th, 2009 at 8:02am:
Timothy -

That is beautiful work. If slings were not made that way, they should have been!

Could you explain a little about the triangular loom? I'm not clear how that all works.


In the picture of the original sling, as well as in the picture of my sling, the pouch is folded so that the cords meet each other. Assuming my analysis of the original is correct, the pouch will also fold flat in half when the cords are pulled apart, and form an obtuse triangle. The loom I used shaped like this triangle. The warp strands go from the base of the triangle over the top and back down to the base on the other side. At the base, the warp strands from both sides of the triangle are held in place with another strand of yarn. In this manner the pouch is actually woven folded in half. Once the weaving is finished, the yarn holding the warps at the base of the loom is removed, and the pouch comes off the loom. This structure of pouch (I've come to call it a "Tut pouch") is not unique to ancient Egypt; I have seen examples from both Turkey and Afghanistan.

The American Museum of Natural History has two slings from Afghanistan with this type of pouch. There are links to this site elsewhere on the forum.

Here's a link to a Turkish sling with a Tut pouch:

http://140.247.102.177/col/shortDisplay.cfm?StartRow=1

It's the fourth one down the list of slings.

-Timothy Potter

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Apr 26th, 2009 at 3:41pm
Ya know Timothy, If ya had taken pictures I'm sure that would be on A$$-kicking Tutorial you could write for the Homepage Articles.

After the Burgess Reconstruction Article we would also have the method for doing the Tut Sling ;)

Marc Adkins


Timothy Potter wrote on Apr 25th, 2009 at 11:22pm:

wanderer wrote on Apr 24th, 2009 at 8:02am:
Timothy -

That is beautiful work. If slings were not made that way, they should have been!

Could you explain a little about the triangular loom? I'm not clear how that all works.


In the picture of the original sling, as well as in the picture of my sling, the pouch is folded so that the cords meet each other. Assuming my analysis of the original is correct, the pouch will also fold flat in half when the cords are pulled apart, and form an obtuse triangle. The loom I used shaped like this triangle. The warp strands go from the base of the triangle over the top and back down to the base on the other side. At the base, the warp strands from both sides of the triangle are held in place with another strand of yarn. In this manner the pouch is actually woven folded in half. Once the weaving is finished, the yarn holding the warps at the base of the loom is removed, and the pouch comes off the loom. This structure of pouch (I've come to call it a "Tut pouch") is not unique to ancient Egypt; I have seen examples from both Turkey and Afghanistan.

The American Museum of Natural History has two slings from Afghanistan with this type of pouch. There are links to this site elsewhere on the forum.

Here's a link to a Turkish sling with a Tut pouch:

http://140.247.102.177/col/shortDisplay.cfm?StartRow=1

It's the fourth one down the list of slings.

-Timothy Potter


Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by funda_iucunda on May 1st, 2009 at 5:18pm
Timothy,

a beautyfull and very accurate work! Looks great! Do you have details of Tuts sling?
Concerning the shape of the pouch I had the experience that if you weave tight and hard the concave shape will form automatically as the higher tension of the weft forces the material to this (at least this is my interpretation). The concave shape is missing at another sling which I made first without weaving it as tight.

funda iucunda

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on May 1st, 2009 at 8:04pm
Ok ya found it :)

Marc Adkins


funda_iucunda wrote on May 1st, 2009 at 5:18pm:
Timothy,

a beautyfull and very accurate work! Looks great! Do you have details of Tuts sling?
Concerning the shape of the pouch I had the experience that if you weave tight and hard the concave shape will form automatically as the higher tension of the weft forces the material to this (at least this is my interpretation). The concave shape is missing at another sling which I made first without weaving it as tight.

funda iucunda


Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Timothy Potter on May 2nd, 2009 at 6:00pm

funda_iucunda wrote on May 1st, 2009 at 5:18pm:
Timothy,

a beautyfull and very accurate work! Looks great! Do you have details of Tuts sling?
Concerning the shape of the pouch I had the experience that if you weave tight and hard the concave shape will form automatically as the higher tension of the weft forces the material to this (at least this is my interpretation). The concave shape is missing at another sling which I made first without weaving it as tight.

funda iucunda


The only information I had to go on with this sling was the Burton photograph. As to the shaping of the original, I looked at the angle formed by the warp strings down the middle of the sling, which looks pretty tight. I think that using tight tension to make the concave shape would make a more rounded, smooth shape, rather than the crisp V that's in the photograph. The sling in Manchester Museum that David Morningstar posted pictures of on this thread a few days ago might be an example of what the tension does to the shape. All this is just my own theory, and I'd love to see others' reconstructions to compare results.
When I have the time, I'll see if I can get some pictures of the loom I made, and how I used it. But I’m not exactly sure where I put it. In fact, though I hate to admit it, I misplaced Tut's sling when I was taking pictures for my website, and it hasn't been seen for several weeks. So, I may have to make another, and that might be better anyway, because then I could document the process.

-Timothy Potter

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on May 3rd, 2009 at 1:57pm
Ok we seem to be talking about several diffrent slings here. There were two slings excavated in Tuts tomb by Dr. Carter. The one that David posted was of the First Lahun Sling.

Marc Adkins



Timothy Potter wrote on May 2nd, 2009 at 6:00pm:

funda_iucunda wrote on May 1st, 2009 at 5:18pm:
Timothy,

a beautyfull and very accurate work! Looks great! Do you have details of Tuts sling?
Concerning the shape of the pouch I had the experience that if you weave tight and hard the concave shape will form automatically as the higher tension of the weft forces the material to this (at least this is my interpretation). The concave shape is missing at another sling which I made first without weaving it as tight.

funda iucunda


The only information I had to go on with this sling was the Burton photograph. As to the shaping of the original, I looked at the angle formed by the warp strings down the middle of the sling, which looks pretty tight. I think that using tight tension to make the concave shape would make a more rounded, smooth shape, rather than the crisp V that's in the photograph. The sling in Manchester Museum that David Morningstar posted pictures of on this thread a few days ago might be an example of what the tension does to the shape. All this is just my own theory, and I'd love to see others' reconstructions to compare results.
When I have the time, I'll see if I can get some pictures of the loom I made, and how I used it. But I’m not exactly sure where I put it. In fact, though I hate to admit it, I misplaced Tut's sling when I was taking pictures for my website, and it hasn't been seen for several weeks. So, I may have to make another, and that might be better anyway, because then I could document the process.

-Timothy Potter


Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Timothy Potter on May 4th, 2009 at 9:01pm

winkleried wrote on May 3rd, 2009 at 1:57pm:
Ok we seem to be talking about several diffrent slings here. There were two slings excavated in Tuts tomb by Dr. Carter. The one that David posted was of the First Lahun Sling.

Marc Adkins


Yes, I was talking about the difference in shape between the pouches on the Tut sling I copied and the Lahun sling David posted.

By the way, I think that there were actually four slings in Tut's tomb. Two of them, which I assume are the ones you are referring to, are in this photograph:

http://www.griffith.ox.ac.uk/gri/carter/gallery/p1324.html

And the other two are in these photographs:

http://www.griffith.ox.ac.uk/gri/carter/gallery/p0086.html
http://www.griffith.ox.ac.uk/gri/carter/gallery/p0087.html

This is the card with the description of these two:

http://www.griffith.ox.ac.uk/gri/carter/021kk.html

They were labeled as a belt, but they sure look to me like slings. Somewhere on the forum I saw pictures of these in a museum display.

-Timothy Potter

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on May 4th, 2009 at 9:14pm
Ok just making sure.
Based ont hose links I agree there could have been four.

Marc Adkins


Timothy Potter wrote on May 4th, 2009 at 9:01pm:

winkleried wrote on May 3rd, 2009 at 1:57pm:
Ok we seem to be talking about several diffrent slings here. There were two slings excavated in Tuts tomb by Dr. Carter. The one that David posted was of the First Lahun Sling.

Marc Adkins


Yes, I was talking about the difference in shape between the pouches on the Tut sling I copied and the Lahun sling David posted.

By the way, I think that there were actually four slings in Tut's tomb. Two of them, which I assume are the ones you are referring to, are in this photograph:

http://www.griffith.ox.ac.uk/gri/carter/gallery/p1324.html

And the other two are in these photographs:

http://www.griffith.ox.ac.uk/gri/carter/gallery/p0086.html
http://www.griffith.ox.ac.uk/gri/carter/gallery/p0087.html

This is the card with the description of these two:

http://www.griffith.ox.ac.uk/gri/carter/021kk.html

They were labeled as a belt, but they sure look to me like slings. Somewhere on the forum I saw pictures of these in a museum display.

-Timothy Potter


Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by David Morningstar on Feb 7th, 2010 at 7:47am

I had another look at the Manchester museum sling today. By taking out a sling of my own and reproducing all the bends and loops of the original cord I got a length of 23 inches for the retention cord, not including the pouch, which I guesstimate to be 6" x2". The retention loop is so  tiny I can only surmise it was used as a slipknot with the retention cord pushed through it.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by slingbadger on Feb 7th, 2010 at 7:00pm
Get us pics and info of this sling. It's a new one on me.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by winkleried on Feb 7th, 2010 at 8:31pm
Badger, If this is the same sling I am thinking of, it is what I call Lahun I in my ground school class.

Wil try and get ya pics either tonight or tomorrow night

Marc Adkins


slingbadger wrote on Feb 7th, 2010 at 7:00pm:
Get us pics and info of this sling. It's a new one on me.


Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by David Morningstar on Feb 8th, 2010 at 4:24am

You've seen it before, its this one:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/23628261@N07/3468684001/


Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Fundibularius on Feb 9th, 2010 at 5:32am
Do you know what is it made of? Some kind of grass?

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by David Morningstar on Feb 9th, 2010 at 1:56pm

Fundibularius wrote on Feb 9th, 2010 at 5:32am:
Do you know what is it made of? Some kind of grass?


Flax cord, I think. Maybe hemp.

Title: Re: Egyptian sling
Post by Fundibularius on Feb 10th, 2010 at 9:24am
Ah, thanks, yes, flax, it seems.

http://images.google.de/imgres?imgurl=http://www.digitalegypt.ucl.ac.uk/lahun/ucarchivelahun/uc6921.gif&imgrefurl=http://www.digitalegypt.ucl.ac.uk/textil/other.html&usg=__7u-dgnjafGFZdqUNDnCNqOgmhAg=&h=500&w=665&sz=69&hl=pt-PT&start=3&um=1&itbs=1&tbnid=yZdfJhp3cuv_LM:&tbnh=104&tbnw=138&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dlahun%2Bsling%26hl%3Dpt-PT%26sa%3DN%26um%3D1

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