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Message started by Douglas on Feb 28th, 2004 at 1:04am

Title: Sling Legality
Post by Douglas on Feb 28th, 2004 at 1:04am
I got in a conversation with a co-worker, and the subject of slings came up. I split for my car, where I kept my trusty strap. When I brought it back, he calmly advised me that I might be arrested for a felony weapon if I was using it in public. He used to be a cop, so he quoted chapter and verse of the California code. I checked, and I saw "slungshot" (which is another weapon entirely) and "slingshot" (recently restricted in California), and the generic "or any deadly weapon".

He said it all depended on the mood of the cop involved and what kind of check I could write for my lawyer...

Later, I was teaching a class on slinging (whence I got the photos for my webpage). We converged at a large empty parking lot by an empty rodeo arena. An animal control officer drove up and saw our slings and asked us to practice out of the city limits. I didn't ask how she recognized the slings.

Hey, let's be careful out there.

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by David_T on Feb 28th, 2004 at 1:25am
Sound like California ;D I love the moutains and the ocean out there!! I lived there in the 70s.

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by Chris on Feb 28th, 2004 at 2:39am
I have thought about this in the past, but luckily slings aren't really considered to be on the same level as bows or slingshots, which is good for us, although it does undermine our sport.  But if you think about it, a pencil is a deadly weapon too, so you can't live in fear.  If you say sorry and move on, I doubt they'd give you much trouble unless you're being a danger to other people.

Chris

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by justbarak on Feb 28th, 2004 at 4:18am
As a child of the jungle, the hardest thing about coming to the States for college was getting use to the rules.  I got kicked out of so many trees in parks b/c it was "dangerous" and "immature" to climb them.  My brother and I use to climb up in the University campus oak trees and hang our hammocks and sleep there all night.  Campus security looked upon us feral MK's (missionary kids - there were about 70 of us on average at this university) with tolerance and let us sleep till about 6am before kicking us out b/f any university professors caught us :o)  lol.

Fortunately in New Mexico you can register for a hand-gun and carry it around the mall in a holster as long as it isn't concealed.  So concealed slings shouldn't be a problem.  My martial arts instructor once got pulled over by a cop for speeding and the cop asked him if he had any weapons in the truck.  My instructor slowly began passing a couple of Chinese swords out the window followed by a pair of nunchuk's, a fighting staff, an assortment of night sticks, rattan eskrima sticks, a butterfly knife, along with many other unspellable (let alone unpronounceable) Asian weapons, and finally a dummy hand gun along with his real hand gun...  After the cop recovered from his shock and discovered that Michael was an instructor he let him go... funny picture to imagine though.  

It does pay to be careful however.  My brother and I were out at our favorite slinging spot which is a 75 foot cliff overlooking the Farmington reservoir.  We were slinging stones out into the lake, and because of the height, altitude, and fairly decent skills, the stones spent a great deal of time in the air before hitting the water several hundred yards out.  On this particular day I made a fantastic fling and as the stone left the cradle, a solitary kayaker came paddling innocently from around the cliff bend.  It's amazing how many prayers you can utter in 10 seconds as we watched the stone descend in it's arc, at the same time try to figure out how we would explain to the police that the dead kayaker in the lake was really hit by a small meteor and that these were really just Peruvian belts wrapped around our waists.   Fortunately God was able to decipher our hastily uttered prayers and the stone landed a good 50 feet off the Kayaker's port bow.  I couldn't see the look on his face, but judging the extreme distance, he must have thought that we were NFL quarter backs practicing our end-zone passes.  We should have just packed it up and gone home, but since God had thoughtfully assigned a couple of guardian angels to keep us out of trouble, we decided it would be rude not give them something to do.    In the spirit of scientific discovery, we next decided to see if we could exceed escape velocity and put the first sling-slung-stone into orbit.  After sending a couple dozen rocks 300 feet straight up into the air, Joel's sling hooked his stone backwards over his head and we watched in slow motion horror as it arced up and then plummeted down, missing the one and only car parked on the lake front by about 10 feet.  Taking that as a sign from God that He was not amused with our keeping His angels occupied, we packed it up and went home...

Anyway, it’s late at night and I felt the urge to reminisce.  No doubt everyone on the forum will be leery of slinging with me should chance ever cross our paths; however I assure you that I have never hit a single soul while slinging (though a strange phenomenon of small meteor showers does seem to follow me which have been known to strike by-standers... But for that I hold mother nature responsible).  

Barak - who loves to hammock in trees and can't wait for summer

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by Dan_Bollinger on Feb 28th, 2004 at 8:57am
Yep, definitely California, where the rules are so muddy that even the DA doesn't know if your paring knife at a picnic is grounds for an arrest.

Since slingstones aren't sharp like arrows and don't travel with the same velocity and accuracy as a 375 magnum, it is less of a weapon and more of a sporting good. Lethality-wise, a sling and slingstone is not much different than a hockey stick and a puck or baseball bat and ball. Heck a hockey stick and bat are dangerous in their own right. Its not like we can bludgeon someone to death with our 2 ounce slings.  

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by WalkingBird on Feb 28th, 2004 at 11:16am
Douglas
      You are right about the need to be careful. For years I've carried a sling in my pack and vehical, never worried about being harrased by anybody. That was because few people knew what it was, and less still, how destructive it can be. This is just not the same world I grew up in. Now that there are so many people who use the sling the laws may change. For our part we just need to be carefull, slinging takes room and it is something that is getting to be less and less available. I'm not supprised about the California law; when people live in fear they tend to pass laws that make them FEEL safe. Living in fear drives people to try and make the world foolproof, a major mistake, but one that has not changed since there have been people living in fear. Somehow they never quite get around to admitting what the real problem is.  Fear God and you need fear no man; fear man and you end up fearing everything. Seems to me the best thing that we slingers can do is to sling responsibably, and always to consider that if people are afraid of what we do, then we may be infringing on their need to feel safe. I know that sounds stupid, but in todays world keeping it formost in our minds may, for a while at least, keep slinging out of the banded by society laws.

Not that it will change things, but that's my two cents

WalkingBird


Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by Hobb on Feb 28th, 2004 at 1:26pm
I used to work in shop that sold self-defense tools, police and security supplies, martial arts and fantasy weapons  -- everything from stun-guns to samurai swords. 8)  We got lots of cops coming through.  Most of them thought we were great and recommended us to friends, family, and their own self-defense students.  Some of them thought we were barely more than criminals and harrassed us.  One officer angrily demanded to know how we got away with selling "all these concealed weapons."  I told him we didn't sell them concealed, and he left in a huff.  The local sherrif even went so far as to falsify evidence against the store's owner in an attempt to get an illegal weapons charge to stick -- He failed.  

Cops aren't lawyers.  They follow departmental policy and use their own judgement.  The bottom line is, anything that scares the cop will be deemed illegal until proven otherwise in a court of law.  I think we slingers should be safe, right up until some chucklehead starts taking potshots at passers-by or taking aim at a lawyer's car window.  












Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by Douglas on Feb 28th, 2004 at 1:28pm

wrote on Feb 28th, 2004 at 8:57am:
Yep, definitely California, where the rules are so muddy that even the DA doesn't know if your paring knife at a picnic is grounds for an arrest.

Right, they'll shoot you on sight for that, and have. :(


Quote:
Since slingstones aren't sharp like arrows and don't travel with the same velocity and accuracy as a 375 magnum....  

Speak for yourself...  ;D

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by David_T on Feb 28th, 2004 at 1:48pm
Good Points everyone! Right you are Walkingbird--about fear that is!!

Barak

Your sound like a good friend of mine. He spends half his nights sleeping outside in his parents back yard rather than in his room. We look for snowstorms and then make plans to hike to the highest mountain this side of the Mississippi during the storm. One April we had 50+ mph winds and the ice and snow was standing out 12" on the windward side of trees. He's one of those "purists" ---a bag of homemade granola, a hunk of bread and he's ready for the hills. That particular trip, as we were in our tent, I fired up my compact stove and had hot Swiss Miss and some hot "just add snow soup"
while he chewed his granola and cold water. He now has a stove ;D ;D

Man!!!!!!!look what you started I'm in a nevous sweat thinking about heading for the hills. Durango here we come! Hey, when I lived in Durando we would get together with a Baptist church in Farmington. We went on a couple "Durango to Silverton Hikes" together. Wow do I miss it out there :'(

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by TechStuf on Feb 28th, 2004 at 1:57pm
JustBarak,


I feel your words!  I have experienced the same things and have felt the same!  I'm certainly not one to blow smoke up one's kilt, but let me say..... that was an engrossing account!  Your writing style is witty and entertaining.  If you are not already, may I suggest having a go professionally?


Peace,

TS


Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by mgreenfield on Mar 1st, 2004 at 11:09am
...a slightly "fat-pouched" sling and bags of tennis-ball ammo should put the local law at ease.    Tennis-balls are exactly 2oz each, and not too bad for closer-in target practice.  You may have to "tune" sling length to fit this ammo.   Get worn out "dead" balls for free at your local tennis club.     Yeah, I know, ....not nearly as much fun as letting fly with a 4oz rock at 200+ yards.    mgreenfield

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by Eudave on Jul 8th, 2019 at 7:18pm
ask them if you can play baseball in the area then ask them  to hit a  5.25 oz baseball at 90 .to 100 miles per hour ask them to hit a target with that and then show them you can hit one at 150 feet with a one oz rock.

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by Rat Man on Jul 8th, 2019 at 9:58pm
    In my state of New Jersey, which probably has the thickest law book in the union, slings are legal and slingshots aren't go figure.  I don't think the powers that be realize the destructive power of the sling or they'd certainly be illegal too.  Many times I've used my slings right in front of the local cops.  They didn't care at all. 

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by NooneOfConsequence on Jul 9th, 2019 at 2:03am
A lot of US jurisdictions (state, city, and county) have “dangerous weapons “ clauses that act as a catch-all. Even if it isn’t explicitly banned, you can still be convicted of a crime... but most places also have exemptions for historical relics and re-enactments, so if your sling looks like a historical replica, you might have a defense, but a sling made from paracord is a hard sell if someone really wants to throw the book at you.

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by Jauke on Jul 9th, 2019 at 5:35am
We have the most ridiculous law here, all catapults are forbidden to own or build. It would even be illegal to build a small trebuchet in my backyard. Slingshots are illegal, slings are illegal. Fine is close to 250 euros. However, chance of a police person knowing what a sling is, is very small.

It has happened many times that hobby fishers with a fishing catapult (for shooting bait) have been fined and their catapult confiscated..

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by Jaegoor on Jul 9th, 2019 at 6:42am
In Deutschland gilt die sling als Spielzeug. Zum Glück. Ich hoffe es bleibt so. Angriffe auf Polizei werden leider häufiger.

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by Frondeur on Jul 9th, 2019 at 8:25am
In france, there's four categories of weapons, rated from A (highly restrected) to D. The sling would definely go as a "C-class weapon" as a propeller shooting over 20joules. Well... Sling is no propeller, merely a lever, and almost every adult human can easily throw a rock with KE over 20j, with or vithout lever... Nah, go and try to explain this to a juge...

legaly, you can own a sling, providing you had no problem with the police before, and you are a registered hunter, or registered sportsman, but you have to register it to the "prefecture de police", witch is a fairly high instance of the police. you cannot go with it, unless not ready to use (a bow must be unstringd; should a sling be unbraided?)
at home it must be secured in a safe or another adapted box.

and if you've been naughty, you risk 2 years of jail, and a 30 000€ fine, up to 7 years and 100 000€ per person if you are - or look like - an organised group.

Well, obviously this nonsense was intended for firearms, and was expanded to include any type of weapon, with little reflexion...

Never heard of someone beeing jailed for sport- or play slinging, but given the justice ways in france... :-X

references:
https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/affichCode.do?idSectionTA=LEGISCTA000027591634&cidTexte=LEGITEXT000025503132
https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/affichCode.do?idSectionTA=LEGISCTA000029658835&cidTexte=LEGITEXT000025503132

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by Kick on Jul 9th, 2019 at 10:09am
Things that are illegal are not always something you'll get arrested for. Unless you are using a sling to hunt or you're actively hurting or endangering people/property I can't see anyone but the most over-zealous cop bothering to go through the paperwork. Might get it taken off you if they're feeling spiteful or you might get a warning but I doubt anyone, anywhere would actually end up in court over slinging practice. I really don't worry. Where I sling, I've been using tennis balls and have already chatted a bit with some of the nearby residents. I think they just think of me as a harmless eccentric. No idea how they got that impression though...

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by hubert on Jul 9th, 2019 at 11:18am
@Jaegoor, in Deutschland gilt die Schleuder als "gefährlicher Gegestand" , wie auch Hämmer, Schraubendreher und ähnliches. Solang man sich von Demos fernhält & sie nicht gegen Tiere, Menschen oder zur Sachbeschädigung nutzt ist alles ok.

Die meisten Polizisten würden sie aber nicht als solche erkennen.

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by timpa on Jul 9th, 2019 at 7:16pm
Finnish law says:
"tarkkuuslingot ja tarkkuussingot ovat kiellettyjä."

Literally, this means: "Accuracy slings and accuracy Bazookas are forbidden."

But in practice, it prohibits wrist-slingshots and weapons that can accurately "throw" something.

Exactly and strictly interpreted, if the sling is accurate, it is forbidden. But it is difficult for the judge to show that the sling is "Accuracy-Sling".

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by TheJackinati on Jul 10th, 2019 at 5:41am
As far as I know, there is actually no specific law prohibiting slings in Western Australia. Whilst Slingshots are illegal, slings are not mentioned or even defined by law (Except Tasmania, which has 'Hunting slings'... which I understand is a slingshot and is not a sling). Weirdly enough, you can buy slingshot projectiles and rubber tubing, but you cannot legally buy or own a slingshot... What!?

This means that If I could get arrested by the police, they'd probably do so under the 'loitering' law, which allows policemen to arrest someone who they think is suspicious and could be a threat... which essentially means to me "Don't be an idiot."... Which I shall try not to be.

And since Lawn-darts are legal... does that mean Cestrosphendone is completely fine! That'd be deadly as all hell! ;D

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by NooneOfConsequence on Jul 10th, 2019 at 8:24pm

TheJackinati wrote on Jul 10th, 2019 at 5:41am:
And since Lawn-darts are legal... does that mean Cestrosphendone is completely fine! That'd be deadly as all hell! ;D


When a human can turn a rock and some string into a deadly weapon, it’s silly to try to ban all these weapons. Once you make assault and murder illegal the rest is superfluous anyway!

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by Rat Man on Jul 11th, 2019 at 9:11pm

NooneOfConsequence wrote on Jul 10th, 2019 at 8:24pm:

TheJackinati wrote on Jul 10th, 2019 at 5:41am:
And since Lawn-darts are legal... does that mean Cestrosphendone is completely fine! That'd be deadly as all hell! ;D


When a human can turn a rock and some string into a deadly weapon, it’s silly to try to ban all these weapons. Once you make assault and murder illegal the rest is superfluous anyway!

Exactly.  I could take a scarf and use it for a sling.  So should scarves be illegal?  It gets ridiculous. 

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by Kick on Jul 12th, 2019 at 10:06am
This is why I say almost everyone will be fine with slinging as long as you aren't being an idiot.

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by yonderstone on Jul 22nd, 2019 at 11:59pm
In Oregon, carrying any weapon concealed is illegal with the exception of a handgun for a person licensed to carry a concealed handgun. Ownership and use of weapons is allowed for most things that are legally owned as long as they are being used outside city limits

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by Genghisken on Aug 7th, 2019 at 9:53am
I'm a Paralegal here in North Carolina and what I find in Most states in the U.S. is that it really doesn't matter what the item is, if it can be "USED" with "Ill Intent" then it can be construed as a dangerous weapon. 

There are no specific bans here in NC on slings.  At least none naming the sling specifically.  However, use it to hurl molotov coctails at a protest and and you better have an attorney on speed dial.

The rule in my household is similar to one of the firearms rules which of course is that we are responsible for the entire travel of that projectile.  There can simply be no "accidentally hit _______" when you release that pouch, you own the contact.  Therefore, plan accordingly when looking for practice grounds and practice ammunition.

In the Army we did not do live fire exercises in downtown Raleigh.  We did them in designated areas where damage to the property and citizenry could be mitigated. 

As for carrying a concealed sling?  Remember that the sling isn't technically a weapon until it is loaded.  It is just a bunch of string which I suppose could be used as a Garotte...but that is another argument.

The final point is that it is highly unlikely we will see a blurb on the 6 o'clock news about a mass slinging incident at a local mall.  Therefore there is likely less knee jerk reaction when someone spots a sling in your hand, but then a lot of that is due to the lack of familiarity.  Until irresponsible slingers give folks a reason to feel threatened by the existence of slings, most folks will be oblivious.

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by walter on Aug 7th, 2019 at 2:20pm
Well said  :thumb:

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by NooneOfConsequence on Aug 7th, 2019 at 9:09pm

Genghisken wrote on Aug 7th, 2019 at 9:53am:
.
The final point is that it is highly unlikely we will see a blurb on the 6 o'clock news about a mass slinging incident at a local mall.  Therefore there is likely less knee jerk reaction when someone spots a sling in your hand, but then a lot of that is due to the lack of familiarity.  Until irresponsible slingers give folks a reason to feel threatened by the existence of slings, most folks will be oblivious.


Ah, but you are forgetting about those high-capacity assault slings that are extra powerful when made out of military-grade paracord! If you tried to hunt with an assault sling, the animal would catch on fire right before it exploded!  There’s no legitimate reason a civilian should own one. 

Title: Re: Sling Legality
Post by Genghisken on Aug 9th, 2019 at 3:41pm

NooneOfConsequence wrote on Aug 7th, 2019 at 9:09pm:

Genghisken wrote on Aug 7th, 2019 at 9:53am:
.
The final point is that it is highly unlikely we will see a blurb on the 6 o'clock news about a mass slinging incident at a local mall.  Therefore there is likely less knee jerk reaction when someone spots a sling in your hand, but then a lot of that is due to the lack of familiarity.  Until irresponsible slingers give folks a reason to feel threatened by the existence of slings, most folks will be oblivious.


Ah, but you are forgetting about those high-capacity assault slings that are extra powerful when made out of military-grade paracord! If you tried to hunt with an assault sling, the animal would catch on fire right before it exploded!  There’s no legitimate reason a civilian should own one. 


oh drat, you do make an excellent point...  :'(

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